Detailed article on Mullen's offense

[AnObfuscator]

Which makes him a good but not great coach... we are paying a good to very good coach elite money to be good or very good. What has Mullen done to be the 5th highest paid coach in NCAA football?

What did he do? He expressed willingness to come here and put out the dumpster fire. Were there better coaches on the market who would have taken $6M to come? Possibly. But we got someone who could fix the program, and paid him what it's worth to the AD for the program to be fixed.

 

[AnObfuscator]

I may be in the minority, but I would have been thrilled to get Richt, seeing how quickly he turned around UGA and Miami. The problem with Richt is that he has a ceiling. FWIW, part of the reason I'm fine with Mullen is that I see him as a Richt-level coach.

 

[TheDouglas78]

What did he do? He expressed willingness to come here and put out the dumpster fire. Were there better coaches on the market who would have taken $6M to come? Possibly. But we got someone who could fix the program, and paid him what it's worth to the AD for the program to be fixed.

So to paraphrase he has done :

To show he is worth being the top 5 coach in Pay... he is Mark Richt which most of us expect. So again what is your argument for his pay raise?

 

[UFHealthGator]

So to paraphrase he has done :

To show he is worth being the top 5 coach in Pay... he is Mark Richt which most of us expect. So again what is your argument for his pay raise?

Who were we supposed to get that is better than Mullen? 47-50 Taggart? Norvell who is surfing on Fuente's coattails, otherwise a complete unkown? We tried CK, he said no. We tried Frost, he said no. There are reports that we even tried Gundy... which I doubt. Who is it that magical home run hire that we were supposed to get for 6 million that is better than Mullen?

 

[TheDouglas78]

Who were we supposed to get that is better than Mullen? 47-50 Taggart? Norvell who is surfing on Fuente's coattails, otherwise a complete unkown? We tried CK, he said no. We tried Frost, he said no. There are reports that we even tried Gundy... which I doubt. Who is it that magical home run hire that we were supposed to get for 6 million that is better than Mullen?

UFHeathGator, there is a difference in getting a coach and overpaying for a coach... the question is why did we overpay for a coach. You're not answering that question.

Do you believe Mullen is a top 5 coach in NCAA Football... and if we didn't get Gundy and settled for Mullen why is Mullen worth a million more a year than Gundy?

 

[AnObfuscator]

Am I cool with that? I've thought about that question too. It depends on what the realistic alternative is. If the realistic alternative is "likely to win multiple national titles", then no. But if it is another decade of irrelevancy, then oh God yes! In my view, with most other coaches we are far more likely to see that latter than the former.

To be fair to Richt, though, I think he had 2 legit title contenders in 2002 and 2012, but 2002 he got screwed because of the Luckeyes, and in 2012 he had the misfortune of his best team facing off against Peak Saban Alabama. Getting to play for a title always includes a little bit of luck; if another team that you never play is perceived as better than you, you may miss out.

 

[UFHealthGator]

UFHeathGator, there is a difference in getting a coach and overpaying for a coach... the question is why did we overpay for a coach. You're not answering that question.

Do you believe Mullen is a top 5 coach in NCAA Football... and if we didn't get Gundy and settled for Mullen why is Mullen worth a million more a year than Gundy?

We are not overpaying. He was getting 4.5 million at MSU for a very cushy job where he was almost revered. Why would he make the move to arguabely one of the most stressful head coaching jobs to make the same pay? I think 6 million is very fair. Do you know of any other head coaches in the SEC that have been relatively successful willing to come to UF?

If we did not give him 6 million, we would have ended up with another Jim Mcelwain type head coach from a small untested program for 4-4.5 million. I thought everyone here hated how cheap Foley was?

 

[AnObfuscator]

UFHeathGator, there is a difference in getting a coach and overpaying for a coach... the question is why did we overpay for a coach. You're not answering that question.

Do you believe Mullen is a top 5 coach in NCAA Football... and if we didn't get Gundy and settled for Mullen why is Mullen worth a million more a year than Gundy?

I guess I would dispute the statement that we are overpaying for a coach. We may be, of course, but I'm not 100% convinced we are. The difference is how we are assessing how much a coach is financially "worth". You are evaluating a coach's value based on how much some other programs are paying top coaches, applying your perception of how Mullen stacks up to those top coaches, and discounting accordingly.

What I (and UFHealthGator, I suspect) are saying is that we see Mullen's value as determined by how much UF Athletics values his perceived quality, and how much UF Athletics believes his contributions to the program are worth.

 

[TheDouglas78]

We are not overpaying. He was getting 4.5 million at MSU for a very cushy job where he was almost revered.

Market value of his job has nothing to do with the fact his last job which almost fired him twice, was cushy.

Why would he make the move to arguabely one of the most stressful head coaching jobs to make the same pay? I thin 6 million is very fair. Do you know of any other head coaches in the SEC that have been relatively successful willing to come to UF?

Chip Kelly wasn't a SEC guy, why are you just looking at SEC coaches... are they the only ones with success? A top 5 job has top 5 benefits and top 5 stress. That's part of the gig. But do you think it is easier or harder to get talent for you team at UF or MSU? Do you think the name brand is harder or easier to sell at UF?

If we did not give him 6 million, we would have ended up with another Jim Mcelwain type head coach from a small untested program for 4-4.5 million.

Conjecture on your part... So because we wouldn't have gotten Mullen or someone similar in your opinion at less than 6.

 

[TheDouglas78]

I guess I would dispute the statement that we are overpaying for a coach. We may be, of course, but I'm not 100% convinced we are. The difference is how we are assessing how much a coach is financially "worth". You are evaluating a coach's value based on how much some other programs are paying top coaches, applying your perception of how Mullen stacks up to those top coaches, and discounting accordingly.

Nick Saban, Dabo Swinney, Jim Harbaugh (who is overpaid due to production), and Urban Meyer are the only coaches in the 6+ range... is Dan Mullen in that group?

What I (and UFHealthGator, I suspect) are saying is that we see Mullen's value as determined by how much UF Athletics values his perceived quality, and how much UF Athletics believes his contributions to the program are worth.

So what you are saying as it's an organizational problem, that we are overpaying?

 

[TheDouglas78]

this is my issue, no candidate comes with risk/reward. Mullen's risk is limited, but so is his ceiling. I would rather swing for elite, than have mediocrity for another 10 years. But not only do we have mediocrity, but we are paying elite money for mediocrity. There are a number of candidates who had potential to be elite, but also the risk they were going to $hit the bed. Too many fans are now comfortable with good, but not great. We fired Zook for being a 9/10 win coach, but it's ok if that is what Mullen is.

 

[AnObfuscator]

I would disagree that Norvell was worth the risk. I think it's less "content with a different picture of The Gators" and more of a different, and more bleak, assessment of where this program is. We're not like 2004, where we were 1-2 classes and the right coach away from a title. We are a 3+ year rebuild project just to get the talent level up to title contention levels, and to coach out all the bad habits and losing mentality this team has acquired. I believe we need at least 3+ years of a Mullen, Richt, or Bellotti type program builder coach to even be nationally relevant again.

FWIW, I don't think Mullen is the kind of guy who can build a year in, year out title contender like Saban has at Alabama. But, if he manages to get another Tim Tebow or Cam Newton QB to run his system, then the sky's the limit. I don't know what kind of odds to put on that.

 

[emr25]

With the way coaching searches and contracts go now, especially in the SEC with the TV money involved, I think we’ll look back in a few years and say Mullen for $6 million per was a bargain.

He’s not a splashy hire, but there will be far less impressive coaches getting paid far more over the next few seasons. If he can stock the cupboards for a few years and instill some discipline in the program, it’ll be worth the investment.

 

[cover2]

I know what you meant :). Let's see what he can muster here at UF before we write him off, from both a recruiting and offensive scheme standpoint. We all can can argue about "what if's" on both sides from now on based on our opinions.

We've got to start somewhere. Again, not a splash, but a solid hire. I'm not joining a Scott Stricklin Conspiracy Theory just yet. I just want to know who the Saban/Meyer clone is that we should have got?

 

[TheDouglas78]

With the way coaching searches and contracts go now, especially in the SEC with the TV money involved, I think we’ll look back in a few years and say Mullen for $6 million per was a bargain.

He’s not a splashy hire, but there will be far less impressive coaches getting paid far more over the next few seasons. If he can stock the cupboards for a few years and instill some discipline in the program, it’ll be worth the investment.

But we didn't buy in a few years, we bought in todays market.. and in today's market he isn't worth $6 million a year.