Summers discusses OL issues/recruiting

-THE DUDE-

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All very true and very devastating truths behind our struggles and hardly is that only on summers. I don't know enough to blame him and i am not making excuses for him but the ol coach isn't solely in charge of recruiting oline...the coaches recruit areas with an assist from the position coach and head coach obviously. There's a lot of blame to go around
 

NavetG8r

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Well lets look at 3 of his O lineman. One a blue chipper and the other two 3 stars which is standard for good O linemen recruits. Sophomores do well in this league many times at OL.

Johnson and Ivey are constantly missing their blocking assignments in these first few games. Johnson almost by himself shut down our running plays in the 2nd half against Tenn due to blocking the wrong guy who was already occupied etc. while allowing his responsibility to blow up the plays. Ivey has whiffed a lot also.

The exception is Taylor who is playing well for a True Freshman. Is the problem those 2 sophomores or is the problem mainly Summers and Taylor is just a natural. I tend to think it may be the latter.

I've seen Law say that the OLinemen need to be the smartest guys on the team. Maybe those two blue chippers just aren't all that sharp? Maybe they have trouble picking up the scheme and processing information on the fly? I have no idea. All I know is the guy has had almost nothing good to work with the whole time he's been here, except a few of the younger guys (who he recruited), that actually seem to have a bit of talent to them. All I'm saying is "his" guys that are left after injuries, seem like they're doing pretty decent to me. It seems like it's Muschamp's blue chippers that are flailing around ole style for the most part. Also, when the O Coordinator starts calling run, run, pass on 3rd and long every series, the Defense starts stacking the box, and once that happens, not many OLine units are going to be successful trying to block more bodies than they have to block with.
 

EuroGator

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We are in a deficit because we have three starters with 2 or less years of College on our line. That isn't on Summers. My issue is the guys in year 3 in his system, still seem to be lost in basic areas of the game.

Well lets look at 3 of his O lineman. One a blue chipper and the other two 3 stars which is standard for good O linemen recruits. Sophomores do well in this league many times at OL.

Johnson and Ivey are constantly missing their blocking assignments in these first few games. Johnson almost by himself shut down our running plays in the 2nd half against Tenn due to blocking the wrong guy who was already occupied etc. while allowing his responsibility to blow up the plays. Ivey has whiffed a lot also.

The exception is Taylor who is playing well for a True Freshman. Is the problem those 2 sophomores or is the problem mainly Summers and Taylor is just a natural. I tend to think it may be the latter.

At least we're making sense now. Thank you.

I would hope that we would see more progress from more players on the OL and would hope that some of the 5-stars would fulfill their projected potential. I don't know how anyone would know whether it's busts on the field or in the coaching staff in such an irregular context. I also think the UToof game was an anomaly where everything fell apart and looked worse than is / will be. ...I sure hope it was.

What is clear is that we've been around half-a-decade with diminishing or poor OL play and we're ready for that to end. There is plenty of justification for dissatisfaction regarding the OL.
 

TheDouglas78

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Well lets look at 3 of his O lineman. One a blue chipper and the other two 3 stars which is standard for good O linemen recruits. Sophomores do well in this league many times at OL.

The problem isn't we have a sophomore, it's that we have two sophomores and a Freshman. They are big boys, but not men either. Some true sophomores do have success, but usually they are surrounded by more experienced players. Our Sophomores gained back habits last year being forced into action. Taylor has played well as a true frosh, but it's only 4 games into this season. Our line has been pushed around by UMASS, UNT, and Tennessee... What will happen against the more experienced groups like LSU, Georgia, and FSU.
 

Gator Fever

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The problem isn't we have a sophomore, it's that we have two sophomores and a Freshman. They are big boys, but not men either. Some true sophomores do have success, but usually they are surrounded by more experienced players. Our Sophomores gained back habits last year being forced into action. Taylor has played well as a true frosh, but it's only 4 games into this season. Our line has been pushed around by UMASS, UNT, and Tennessee... What will happen against the more experienced groups like LSU, Georgia, and FSU.

I only watched the first 3 drives we had of the 2nd half when we kept trying to run the ball mostly and it really didn't appear to be strength issue at all to me and more mental like you mention. On at least 4 of those runs the play was only blown up due to mental mistakes by a blocker (mostly Johnson) or they all would have had good positive gains.
 

Marianna-FL_Gator

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I wonder what his excuse is for guys like Sharpe,Ivey,and Johnson repeatedly blowing assignments which directly leads to the run getting blowed up or a QB sack? No way should they still be blowing this many assignments...that's on him and his piss poor coaching ability!
 

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It is really amazing the we (the University of Florida Fighting Gators) find ourselves in this situation. How? Why? I am afraid the hole dug by Will Muschamp is going to take a long time to climb out of. Thanks again, Jeremy.
 

TheBigClaw

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Well lets look at 3 of his O lineman. One a blue chipper and the other two 3 stars which is standard for good O linemen recruits. Sophomores do well in this league many times at OL.

Johnson and Ivey are constantly missing their blocking assignments in these first few games. Johnson almost by himself shut down our running plays in the 2nd half against Tenn due to blocking the wrong guy who was already occupied etc. while allowing his responsibility to blow up the plays. Ivey has whiffed a lot also.

The exception is Taylor who is playing well for a True Freshman. Is the problem those 2 sophomores or is the problem mainly Summers and Taylor is just a natural. I tend to think it may be the latter.
 

GatorJ

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THIS is why you always recruit 6 to 7 offensive linemen every class. That's between 24 to 28 OL. One third will transfer, get hurt, or never pan out. That puts you at 16-20 OL. That's 2 deep at all 5 positions with one line of redshirts when signing 6 a class.
 

BMF

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THIS is why you always recruit 6 to 7 offensive linemen every class. That's between 24 to 28 OL. One third will transfer, get hurt, or never pan out. That puts you at 16-20 OL. That's 2 deep at all 5 positions with one line of redshirts when signing 6 a class.

We currently have ONE OL commit.....
 

-THE DUDE-

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It is really amazing the we (the University of Florida Fighting Gators) find ourselves in this situation. How? Why? I am afraid the hole dug by Will Muschamp is going to take a long time to climb out of. Thanks again, Jeremy.
Our oline recruiting issues started with the end of the Meyer era and muscrap...6 oline (3 that never made it) in 3 years is an absolute killer. The guy who coined the phrase here "line of scrimmage league" neglected 1 side of that line
 

rogdochar

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These whines of "Oh we alone have been cursed" do not cut it. Tennessee's OL is in
a similar or even younger state. Mac's mindset need only to recognize that better coaching
abilities are bound to be out there -- go get them without delay.

IMO, instead of a S & C coach, we need a strength coach and a separate conditioning/stamina
coach. (In track I'm sure the sprint coach isn't training the distance runners.)
 

Swamp Donkey

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When you say down linemen, do you mean defensive linemen too? Because 12 players is half of an average recruiting class.
Let's look at Bammer's classes:

2016
Jonah Williams OL 280
Chris Owens OL 315
Deonte Brown OL 320
Charles Baldwin OL 305
Scott Lashley OL 298
Kendell Jones DT 351
Quinnen Williams DT 265
Raekwon Davis DT 305
Jamar King DE 285
Terrell Hall DE 251

2015
Dallas Warmack OL 306
Lester Cotton OL 321
Richie Petitbon OL 309
Brandon Kennedy OL 293
Matt Womack OL 330
Daron Payne DT 335
Jonathan Taylor DT 335
Christian Bell DE 216
Mekhi Brown DE 217
Anfernee JenningsDE 260

2014
J.C. Hassenauer OL 295
Dominick Jackson OL 312
Montel McBride OL 332
Ross Pierschbacher OL 295
Cameron Robinson OL 320
Joshua Casher OL 300
Johnny Dwight DT 298
Josh Frazier DT 334
Jarran Reed DT 305
O.J. Smith DT 330
Da'Shawn Hand DE 260
D.J. Pettway DE 255

2013
Grant Hill OL 301
Leon Brown OL 300
Cole Mazza OL 240 ***this one is curious and from Bakersfield, CA
Brandon Hill OL 390
Darius Paige DT 314
A'Shawn Robinson DT 320
Dee Liner DE 281
Jonathan Allen DE 263
Tim Williams DE 235

So, Bammer recruited 41 linemen in 4 years. Of those, only 3 were below 250 lbs. 22 were over 300 lbs.
In that time, UF recruited 39 linemen. 10 were lightweights and 9 were heavies. Also of note: ZERO DTs in 2016 and only ONE in 2015. THIS IS ON MAC & CO not Chimp.

Look, I'm not saying you can't play a few smallish, rush ends, but you sure as hell can't play ten of them. That's half our d line recruits for third and long rush specialists.

While we are at it, lets note their linebackers and sizes:
2016
Ben Davis LB 236
Lyndell Wilson LB 235

2015
Keaton Anderson LB 208
Joshua McMillon LB 246
Adonis Thomas LB 219

2014
Keaton Anderson LB 208
Joshua McMillon LB 246
Adonis Thomas LB 219

2013
Walker Jones LB 234
Reuben Foster LB 244

UF recruited Eight linebackers to Bammers 10. During that time, Bammer recruited 6 backers who weighed 230 or more. UF recruited ONE SINGLE INSIDE LB (230 lbs or better). Also of note: ZERO linebackers in 2014. One LB in 2015. AGAIN MAC & CO have caused the problem, not Chimp.

While we are at it, lets look at DBs, 2 DBs in 2013, 3 in 2014, and 3 in 2016. There was only one year when Bammer took a lot of DBs, 2015, when they took 5. However, my theory with that class is that one is named Deionte Thompson and Bammer knew he probably would suck.

Now our chance to shine! 16 DBs in those 4 years compared to Bammers 13. DBU smells like Mustank.

We currently have ONE OL commit.....
:trainwreck:
 
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Concrete Helmet

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I wonder what his excuse is for guys like Sharpe,Ivey,and Johnson repeatedly blowing assignments which directly leads to the run getting blowed up or a QB sack? No way should they still be blowing this many assignments...that's on him and his piss poor coaching ability!
Exactly. I've noticed that sometimes we get a little excited about seeing a freshmen play and hold their own. Guys like Sharpe, Ivey and Johnson all played as freshmen and did as well as could be expected so you want to believe they will be pretty good by their second year.....but sometimes it just doesn't happen, sorry but that's usually coaching failure to develop. Hell, even Sharpe who is usually decent in pass blocking has made NO improvements what so ever as a run blocker. Ivey sometimes looks more lost this year than last and we really haven't seen enough of Jordan to know what steps he's taken.
I didn't expect the offensive line to be world beaters this year but with improved depth and at least a little experience I thought they would be consistently average......Sometimes they've looked decent and then in the same game it's like someone erased their memory or something.
 

Swamp Donkey

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Exactly. I've noticed that sometimes we get a little excited about seeing a freshmen play and hold their own.
Generally, playing too early at OL and QB is detrimental. Some never seem to get their confidence back.
 

Marianna-FL_Gator

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Exactly. I've noticed that sometimes we get a little excited about seeing a freshmen play and hold their own. Guys like Sharpe, Ivey and Johnson all played as freshmen and did as well as could be expected so you want to believe they will be pretty good by their second year.....but sometimes it just doesn't happen, sorry but that's usually coaching failure to develop. Hell, even Sharpe who is usually decent in pass blocking has made NO improvements what so ever as a run blocker. Ivey sometimes looks more lost this year than last and we really haven't seen enough of Jordan to know what steps he's taken.
I didn't expect the offensive line to be world beaters this year but with improved depth and at least a little experience I thought they would be consistently average......Sometimes they've looked decent and then in the same game it's like someone erased their memory or something.
It's been disappointing as hell watching these boys play...that's for damn sure!
 

Gator Fever

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I wish we could put Jordan's decision making ability in Johnson's and Ivey's head. He seems to almost always block the right guy.
 

ThreatMatrix

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Two propositions:
A) We have limited numbers and experience
B) Summers is not a good coach
Those two things are not mutually exclusive. A tends to obfuscate B. Evidence mounts that both are simultaneously true.
 

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