Mac QB Production vs Jimbo's QB Production Yr 2

[Marianna-FL_Gator]

....and yet, still a 1st round draft pick. The point is he developed into a very productive college QB. Was Tebow a bad draft pick? If you ask anyone beside a Florida Gators fan the answer is 90+% "yes". But the point is, he (Tebow) was a very productive college QB. This thread is silly, stupid, pointless (well, it makes a bad point).

Tebow has more playoff wins than every QB Jimbo has coached COMBINED! So if he was a "bad pick" wtf we're they??? Bottom line is Jimbo is an overrated coach who does less with more than any coach in CFB. If not for the 2 generational talents (winston/cook) making his a$$ look good for the past few yrs he would have been fired already.

 

[BMF]

Tebow has more playoff wins than every FSU QB Jimbo has coached COMBINED! So if he was a "bad pick" wtf we're they??? Bottom line is Jimbo is an overrated coach who does less with more than any coach in CFB. If not for the 2 generational talents (winston/cook) making his a$$ look good for the past few yrs he would have been fired already.

Yeah, yeah I get it. This is a Gator board; Tebow is the greatest QB ever (college or pro) and FSU sucks. Got it. Company line....

 

[Marianna-FL_Gator]

Yeah, yeah I get it. This is a Gator board; Tebow is the greatest QB ever (college or pro) and FSU sucks. Got it. Company line....

Just facts...nothing more ;)

 

[t-gator]

I would tend to agree if he was replacing defensive studs with studs. On paper it does not appear to be that way per the % of blue chippers. It's at a recruiting low. Not sure how you can even go there.

WHile it needs to be played out...there's no way you can compare this D to that Bama team or even any recent Gator team.

I would compare the 2012 D to any that Bama has put on the field.

 

[TheDouglas78]

He also produced the dud (#1 pick) from LSU. As much as we all want to disparage Jimbo and more so, FSU....the fact is the guy can coach QBs. In fact, he's arguably the best QB coach in college football (numbers don't lie). I hate the guy, but he's produced very productive COLLEGE QBs. And because those college QBs play at a high-level P5 school they tend to be top NFL prospects. Sure, 3 of his 4 1st rounders have been duds....once they leave school they are no longer "his", they belong to their new coach - the NFL coach.

My point is this thread is stupid. Talking sh*t about Fisher's QBs? That's just stupid. He beat us w/ McGuire and a redshirt freshman twice (last year - and Jameis). He's an *******, but he has a proven track record of developing QBs. Period. You can't argue it. The kid he has there now (Francios?) looks like he's going to be a good one too. Dammit.

Other than Jameis whom has really made an impact on the College football landscape?
Winston 66% 7964 yards 65/28 over 2 years (notice how in two years he has better status than anyone else?)

FSU:
Everett Golson 67.1% 1778 yards 11/3 (1 year under Fisher)
Sean Maguire 57.9% 2039 yards 16/11 ints over 4 years
Christian Ponder 61.5% 6872 yards 49/30 over 4 years (2717 is a one season high)
EJ Manuel 66.9% 7741 yards 47/28 over 4 years (3397 season high)
Francois 58.8% 3350 yards 20/7 (too early to tell)

LSU:
Josh Booty 50% 2121 yards 17/15 (1 year under Fisher)
Rohan Davey 59.9% 3924 yards 25/11 (2 years under Fisher)
Matt Mauck 58.6% 3831 yards 37/18 (3 years under Fisher)
Marcus Randall 56.1% 2854 yards 18/12 (4 years under Fisher)
Jamarcus Russell 61.9% 6625 yards 52/21 (3 years under Fisher [3129 biggest season])
Matt Flynn 53.8% 689 yards 10/2 (3 years under Fisher [took over starter the following season])

Your right numbers don't lie, he has had a bunch of guys, which you are making sound better than they were. He was able to get NFL teams to take his quarterbacks in bad quarterback drafts (except Jameis which was a decent QB draft). Are you saying that he is one of the top college producers of quarterbacks, take a look at the stats of most of his quarterbacks.

As far as he beat us with X, Spurrier beat us with a 3rd string quarterback at South Carolina... when you opponent can't get out of their own way (hell we even blocked ourselves in two of those years), and you are the superior talented team, which has been the case since probably 2010.. then you should win.

 

[TheDouglas78]

I would compare the 2012 D to any that Bama has put on the field.

When T is right, T is right. But a broken clock is right a couple of times a day.

 

[TheDouglas78]

Just for Reference Spurrier Quarterbacks (before the rules that let WR run free)

Shane Matthews 60.1% 9287 74/46 (3 years, 3205 high)
Terry Dean 57.9% 3420 39/23 (4 years, 1651 high)
Danny Wuerfell 60.5% 10875 114/42 (4 years, 3625 high)
Doug Johnson 55.6% 7114 yards 62/36 (4 years, 2574 high)
Noah Brindise 49.4% 723 yards 6/3 (3 years, 695 high)
Eric Kreser 58.1 1572 18/5 (3 years, 992 high)
Jesse Palmer 53% 3755 31/17 (4 years, 1653 high)
Rex Grossman 61% 9164 77/36 (3 years, 3896 high)
Brock Berlin 60.9% 653 11/2 (2 years, 483 high)

 

[T REX]

Under Mac, we already have gotten some highly rated defensive guys and more importantly Mac has addressed depth needs. He also evaluates under the radar guys well. He wants a certain type that fits his system which is more important than taking guys who don't fit just bc theyre ranked high.

The numbers don't agree with you in reference to winning but I appreciate your positive attitude. Addressing needs with 3 stars is still replacing talent with lesser talent. No matter how you slice it or dice it. It is fact.

 

[BMF]

Other than Jameis whom has really made an impact on the College football landscape?
Winston 66% 7964 yards 65/28 over 2 years (notice how in two years he has better status than anyone else?)

FSU:
Everett Golson 67.1% 1778 yards 11/3 (1 year under Fisher)
Sean Maguire 57.9% 2039 yards 16/11 ints over 4 years
Christian Ponder 61.5% 6872 yards 49/30 over 4 years (2717 is a one season high)
EJ Manuel 66.9% 7741 yards 47/28 over 4 years (3397 season high)
Francois 58.8% 3350 yards 20/7 (too early to tell)

LSU:
Josh Booty 50% 2121 yards 17/15 (1 year under Fisher)
Rohan Davey 59.9% 3924 yards 25/11 (2 years under Fisher)
Matt Mauck 58.6% 3831 yards 37/18 (3 years under Fisher)
Marcus Randall 56.1% 2854 yards 18/12 (4 years under Fisher)
Jamarcus Russell 61.9% 6625 yards 52/21 (3 years under Fisher [3129 biggest season])
Matt Flynn 53.8% 689 yards 10/2 (3 years under Fisher [took over starter the following season])

Your right numbers don't lie, he has had a bunch of guys, which you are making sound better than they were. He was able to get NFL teams to take his quarterbacks in bad quarterback drafts (except Jameis which was a decent QB draft). Are you saying that he is one of the top college producers of quarterbacks, take a look at the stats of most of his quarterbacks.

As far as he beat us with X, Spurrier beat us with a 3rd string quarterback at South Carolina... when you opponent can't get out of their own way (hell we even blocked ourselves in two of those years), and you are the superior talented team, which has been the case since probably 2010.. then you should win.

So, by this measure Steve Spurrier was a shltty coach....since he only coached 1 Heisman winner and only 1 first round pick vs. 4 1st round picks, 1 Heisman, and two #1 overall picks. Got it. Thanks for enlightening me.

 

[gators4224]

The numbers don't agree with you in reference to winning but I appreciate your positive attitude. Addressing needs with 3 stars is still replacing talent with lesser talent. No matter how you slice it or dice it. It is fact.

Highly rated guys are important, but the recruiting services aren't able to evaluate everybody. Also, a recruiting class should also be looked at holistically and not just based on rankings. Did the class address needs? Did the class help create competition at thin spots? Did the guys taken fit the system we want to run/are running? Im not diminishing the 5-star argument either because those guys are important, just making the argument that there are other considerations to be looked at as well.

 

[TheDouglas78]

So, by this measure Steve Spurrier was a shltty coach....since he only coached 1 Heisman winner and only 1 first round pick vs. 4 1st round picks, 1 Heisman, and two #1 overall picks. Got it. Thanks for enlightening me.

BMF if we are judging by college production (your argument) then what the fck is your statement here about. It's a classic deflection because you don't have a real argument. Come back when you have an argument other than DDDDDDDDDDDDDDUUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

[-THE DUDE-]

Highly rated guys are important, but the recruiting services aren't able to evaluate everybody. Also, a recruiting class should also be looked at holistically and not just based on rankings. Did the class address needs? Did the class help create competition at thin spots? Did the guys taken fit the system we want to run/are running? Im not diminishing the 5-star argument either because those guys are important, just making the argument that there are other considerations to be looked at as well.

They aren't able to evaluate everybody, they have biases based on if the kids camped, where they camped, and which all-star game they decided to go to, etc. They also will adjust rankings/stars based off offer lists later on once they realized they might have missed someone. Even if they could scout every single person it's still an imperfect science...hell look at the NFL draft where they are scouting even more and they fail to get it right over half the time...and those are professional scouts not writers pretending they know what they are doing.

 

[BMF]

BMF if we are judging by college production (your argument) then what the fck is your statement here about. It's a classic deflection because you don't have a real argument. Come back when you have an argument other than DDDDDDDDDDDDDDUUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Doug, you're right. Jimbo is a terrible coach, especially when it comes to QBs. I have no clue why any top QB would want to play for him and I'm even more perplexed that he can out-recruit the QB Whisperer. My bad. You're the man! Thanks for enlightening me and opening my eyes to how bad of a coach Jimbo really is.....

 

[TheDouglas78]

Doug, you're right. Jimbo is a terrible coach, especially when it comes to QBs. I have no clue why any top QB would want to play for him and I'm even more perplexed that he can out-recruit the QB Whisperer. My bad. You're the man! Thanks for enlightening me and opening my eyes to how bad of a coach Jimbo really is.....

Again deflection... Dude if you are going to make an argument, then not support it... it's on you. What quarterback other than Jameis made his impact on NCAA football (which was your argument). Instead you argument is, Jimbo is a great quarterback coach facts don't lie, presented with facts... well then everyone is $hit (deflection), then the oooohhhh I'm so wrong your so right (deflection)... I thought you were better than that, guess I was wrong.

 

[BMF]

Again deflection... Dude if you are going to make an argument, then not support it... it's on you. What quarterback other than Jameis made his impact on NCAA football (which was your argument). Instead you argument is, Jimbo is a great quarterback coach facts don't lie, presented with facts... well then everyone is $hit (deflection), then the oooohhhh I'm so wrong your so right (deflection)... I thought you were better than that, guess I was wrong.

First off, WTF does "made his impact on NCAA football" mean?

His 1st pick in the draft at LSU Jamarcus Russell. Russell was his QB for 2 years until he left for FSU. LSU won some pretty big games under Saban/Jimbo. I'm not sure what kind of "impact on NCAA football" that is though.

EJ Manuel won an ACC title and a BCS game.....and was a 1st round NFL draft pick. Is winning FSU's 1st ACC title in 7 years impactful enough?

Christian Ponder went on to a solid career and essentially was the kick starter to FSU coming back on the national stage.....and was the 12th overall draft pick. Impactful enough for you?

So, Fisher has been at FSU for 7 years now and has had THREE of his QBs go in the first round - with one winning a Heisman and being the #1 overall pick (for clarification, he's had 2 of his players taken #1 overall - UF has NEVER had a player taken #1 overall in the 100+ year history of the program). And he now has a star in the making w/ Francois, who as a freshman put up solid numbers.

But I get it. This is a Gator board and it's blasphamy to talk "nice" about FSU.

I'm done "arguing" w/ you on this topic. You're right and I'm wrong.....

 

[GatorBart]

First off, WTF does "made his impact on NCAA football" mean?

His 1st pick in the draft at LSU Jamarcus Russell. Russell was his QB for 2 years until he left for FSU. LSU won some pretty big games under Saban/Jimbo. I'm not sure what kind of "impact on NCAA football" that is though.

EJ Manuel won an ACC title and a BCS game.....and was a 1st round NFL draft pick. Is winning FSU's 1st ACC title in 7 years impactful enough?

Christian Ponder went on to a solid career and essentially was the kick starter to FSU coming back on the national stage.....and was the 12th overall draft pick. Impactful enough for you?

So, Fisher has been at FSU for 7 years now and has had THREE of his QBs go in the first round - with one winning a Heisman and being the #1 overall pick (for clarification, he's had 2 of his players taken #1 overall - UF has NEVER had a player taken #1 overall in the 100+ year history of the program). And he now has a star in the making w/ Francois, who as a freshman put up solid numbers.

But I get it. This is a Gator board and it's blasphamy to talk "nice" about FSU.

I'm done "arguing" w/ you on this topic. You're right and I'm wrong.....

I think you just supported your case.
I didn't like reading it...............because it's true.

 

[TheDouglas78]

First off, WTF does "made his impact on NCAA football" mean?

His 1st pick in the draft at LSU Jamarcus Russell. Russell was his QB for 2 years until he left for FSU. LSU won some pretty big games under Saban/Jimbo. I'm not sure what kind of "impact on NCAA football" that is though.

One the west once, never won the conference. Jimbo had Russell for three years, left for FSU after Jamarcus left for FSU (2006 season). You knew with Jamarcus he had great talent, but would give you 2-3 int throws if your DB's took advantage of it. For a guy with his physical gifts, from his Freshman to his Junior year he really didn't grow as a QB.

EJ Manuel won an ACC title and a BCS game.....and was a 1st round NFL draft pick. Is winning FSU's 1st ACC title in 7 years impactful enough?

Was EJ Manuel a guy you were scared of? He won the ACC at the time it was the Almost Competitive Conference, that similar to winning the SEC East today. I would say And? What did he do... EJ Manuel was so special NFL teams knew Fisher pushed him out the door for Winston. But the Bills picked him up... and they know quarterbacks as evidenced by every quarterback they have picked since Jim Kelly was drafted (then went to the USFL). Now he did beat us when we were $hitty team, except losing to Driskel in a surprising high scoring game (37-26) (Can't remember if he played against us his freshman year). His BCS bowl game was against Northern Illinois that is a game he is supposed to win.

Christian Ponder went on to a solid career and essentially was the kick starter to FSU coming back on the national stage.....and was the 12th overall draft pick. Impactful enough for you?

Solid career, so did Doug Johnson. So do a lot of guys, the best thing Christian did is Sam Ponder.

So, Fisher has been at FSU for 7 years now and has had THREE of his QBs go in the first round - with one winning a Heisman and being the #1 overall pick (for clarification, he's had 2 of his players taken #1 overall - UF has NEVER had a player taken #1 overall in the 100+ year history of the program). And he now has a star in the making w/ Francois, who as a freshman put up solid numbers.

First with your opening line, then why bring up Jamacus Russell. So your argument is because he has players picked first overall, and two were picked in the 1st round that that makes his a quarterback guru?

First pick over all argument:
So does that make Gene Chizik a better quarterback coach than Spurrier, he had a quarterback go first overall and Spurrier never has?

Francois looks like he could be good, it's too early to tell. If Francois ends up being more Jameis than the other jabornies. Then I would agree with your assessment. But right now, he has a bunch of guys who talented and solid. But not really great. Their is a real question if it is the talent and not him that keeps them rolling. Without Jameis he is a coach who loses against opponents he shouldn't and overall he is a coach that is a 2-3 loss/year coach with a schedule that he doesn't play a team with equal talent but maybe one or two games a season (3+ losses/year without Winston).

Now I'm not a fan of Jimbo (not because of FSU, I think he is overrated), so I might be more critical. I just don't see where he really has made his players better. He can hang his hat on Winston, and possibly Francois which I think it is too early to tell. If he develops Francois into a better quarterback then I'll agree. I just don't see where he has done that.

 

[ThreatMatrix]

I know of Steve Spurrier, I watched every game he coached, was at every game he coached at home and a few away and this I can tell you, Jimbo Fisher is no Steve Spurrier.

 

[Swamp Donkey]

I know of Steve Spurrier, I watched every game he coached, was at every game he coached at home and a few away and this I can tell you, Jimmy Donkeyteeth is also no Steve Spurrier.

 

[Swamp Donkey]

One question, did Jimbo Bowdenbastard finish 105th and 116th?

I will hang up and listen.