McElwain Eulogy/Presser

[T REX]

For the 1000th time, no one is hanging their hats on a division title as some career maker accomplishment.

Perfect. Because it's not. Which means we probably agree overall.

EDIT: And I would easily argue the teams at the top are much better in 13/14 than the trash of the last two years. BTW, we had the worst curb-stomping in SEC title game history. Not much to hang onto there.

 

[Blacklabgator]

keep loving on ol mac... he'll be gone soon tho so you'll have to change teams.

If by soon you mean 12-15 months I agree with you.

 

[NavetG8r]

Perfect. Because it's not. Which means we probably agree overall.

EDIT: And I would easily argue the teams at the top are much better in 13/14 than the trash of the last two years. BTW, we had the worst curb-stomping in SEC title game history. Not much to hang onto there.

You have to be there to win it. UGA, UT, Ky, USCe, Vandy, Mizzou would all give their left nuts to be in Atlanta instead of us. It IS an accomplishment to get there. No matter how trivial you try to make it.

 

[soflagator]

Perfect. Because it's not. Which means we probably agree overall.

EDIT: And I would easily argue the teams at the top are much better in 13/14 than the trash of the last two years. BTW, we had the worst curb-stomping in SEC title game history. Not much to hang onto there.

So UF's record in 2015 was earned only because of how poor the rest of the division was(despite the vols and bulldogs winning 9 & 10 games respectively). That's been your mantra for some time.

But Usce and Mizzou's records in 2013-14 (while UF and ut were at historical lows and uga was average) was because of how good they were in those years? They certainly weren't, themselves, taking advantage of a weak East those years, right? After all, nothing says "we're the Champs and we earned it" like Mizzou being beaten 34-0 at home by fellow division foe uga in 2014.

To your first point, yes, we would both agree on that. But as I continued, it was definitely a positive step forward for a team that was projected to win around 6 games. Anyone who's seemingly praising JM is really just acknowledging that some of what he's done here has been positive. We all agreed that 2017 was his team, and a critical year for him. We're 2 games in against 2 P5 teams, one at a neutral site and one at home days after a hurricane. May as well let it play out.

And with regards to the worst SECCG loss, that belongs to Usce(and Spurrier) in 2010. So as ugly as last December's game was, you're wrong again.

 

[NavetG8r]

I'm not at all happy with the offense so far this year, but even I can admit there were some signs in the UT game where maybe they actually made some adjustments between game 1 and game 2 (3 actually, but 2 never happened). That gives me a little hope going forward. If our RBs will stop turning the ball over, and they allow Franks to continue to develop and don't handcuff him too much, things could improve. Still don't think Nuss is a very good OC, but he did make some pretty good calls at the right times against UT.

 

[T REX]

So UF's record in 2015 was earned only because of how poor the rest of the division was(despite the vols and bulldogs winning 9 & 10 games respectively). That's been your mantra for some time.

But Usce and Mizzou's records in 2013-14 (while UF and ut were at historical lows and uga was average) was because of how good they were in those years? They certainly weren't, themselves, taking advantage of a weak East those years, right? After all, nothing says "we're the Champs and we earned it" like Mizzou being beaten 34-0 at home by fellow division foe uga in 2014.

To your first point, yes, we would both agree on that. But as I continued, it was definitely a positive step forward for a team that was projected to win around 6 games. Anyone who's seemingly praising JM is really just acknowledging that some of what he's done here has been positive. We all agreed that 2017 was his team, and a critical year for him. We're 2 games in against 2 P5 teams, one at a neutral site and one at home days after a hurricane. May as well let it play out.

And with regards to the worst SECCG loss, that belongs to Usce(and Spurrier) in 2010. So as ugly as last December's game was, you're wrong again.

Yup, you are right 38 point beat down to 39 point beat down. How did I miss that? I guess compared to Chump? Yeah, Mac is a partial step up. I can't say much more than that as of yet.

 

[T REX]

I'm not at all happy with the offense so far this year, but even I can admit there were some signs in the UT game where maybe they actually made some adjustments between game 1 and game 2 (3 actually, but 2 never happened). That gives me a little hope going forward. If our RBs will stop turning the ball over, and they allow Franks to continue to develop and don't handcuff him too much, things could improve. Still don't think Nuss is a very good OC, but he did make some pretty good calls at the right times against UT.

Scoring your 1st offensive TD 7 quarters into the year and two total. I'm just not seeing that "improvement". Maybe it is me.

 

[T REX]

You have to be there to win it. UGA, UT, Ky, USCe, Vandy, Mizzou would all give their left nuts to be in Atlanta instead of us. It IS an accomplishment to get there. No matter how trivial you try to make it.

Cool beans. Wear your back to back East Champs t shirt. I won't.

I'm done here btw. You two pumpers win!

 

[soflagator]

Yup, you are right 38 point beat down to 39 point beat down. How did I miss that? I guess compared to Chump? Yeah, Mac is a partial step up. I can't say much more than that as of yet.

Neither can many. But there are slight signs that we could be going in the right direction, even if only having a young QB that we can build around plus a great one on the way. We'll know more of what we have at year's end. But we may as well try to enjoy things and hope for the best(which is what I think we're all are doing anyway).

And ftr, I'm not a "pumper". I simply can do math, have the internet, and know how to lose an argument. Very important.

 

[T REX]

Neither can many. But there are slight signs that we could be going in the right direction, even if only having a young QB that we can build around plus a great one on the way. We'll know more of what we have at year's end. But we may as well try to enjoy things and hope for the best(which is what I think we're all are doing anyway).

And ftr, I'm not a "pumper". I simply can do math, have the internet, and know how to lose an argument. Very important.

Touche lol. Hey, maybe we'll all be pleasantly surprised.

 

[NavetG8r]

Scoring your 1st offensive TD 7 quarters into the year and two total. I'm just not seeing that "improvement". Maybe it is me.

So I guess the quick slants. Perine's long run that ended in a fumble. Davis' long run that would've been a TD if not for an amazing play by a UT defender, and Frank's ability to see Cleveland come open and hit him perfectly in stride for the game winning TD means no progress to you. Alrighty then...

 

[T REX]

So I guess the quick slants. Perine's long run that ended in a fumble. Davis' long run that would've been a TD if not for an amazing play by a UT defender, and Frank's ability to see Cleveland come open and hit him perfectly in stride for the game winning TD means no progress to you. Alrighty then...

Hilarious. Sorry I'm not buying. Keep telling yourself that though.

 

[TheBigClaw]

So I guess the quick slants. Perine's long run that ended in a fumble. Davis' long run that would've been a TD if not for an amazing play by a UT defender, and Frank's ability to see Cleveland come open and hit him perfectly in stride for the game winning TD means no progress to you. Alrighty then...

View attachment 7224

As much as I hate it there is no progress. We had one nice run with Davis and then 1 nice run with Perine also fumbled. 2 runs that are decent but end in fumbles are progress? Also, I do believe franks is getting a bit better but he needs good coaching and play calling to achieve his potential which I don't believe we have. As well as an OL with a pulse.

 

[BLACKCELL]

lol ok... its me that is pining for saban ball, while you just love a guy who trys to run the same crap offense as him, but cant recruit, or coach. I will keep hating... on mac. Our team, our school, our fans, and especially these players deserve a hell of a lot better than what he and his cracker jack staff bring to the table. Mac is not UF, sorry you cant understand the distinction.

Agree to disagree. Mac needs to make changes and if he doesn't then he should be on the block. I miss being the powerhouse we once were but am willing to support what we got until the end of the season...

 

[Swamp Donkey]

Neither can many. But there are slight signs that we could be going in the right direction,

It pains me to see sofla reduced to this.

 

[t-gator]

The numbers have been posted before. Over 7 teams, and spanning 2 full seasons, there is a grand total of 6 games difference between those two time frames. The point margin in the annual West beatdown in Atl averaged 23 points in '13-'14. Alabama's average margin in our 2 games ('15-'16) was 26.

For the 1000th time, no one is hanging their hats on a division title as some career maker accomplishment. But it is, without question, a step in the right direction, and one that most did not anticipate us doing in his first 2 years, even with the East being down. It's really not debatable.

It was an accomplishment by our defense to win the east twice. Not jim mclewain. What did he bring to the table? Someone asked me a few weeks ago if i thought mac was just a bystander through it all. Yes i do. He just happened to be the guy on the sidelines while a defense that will muschamp recruited carried us.
Also, i wouldn't put either of macs 1st two seasons on par with will muschamps 11 win season. Atleast we beat some great teams and had some blowouts.

 

[soflagator]

It pains me to see sofla reduced to this.

If you're going to quote me, don't take my words out of context. I've stated numerous times that I'm fine with criticisms and would be perfectly ok with his dismissal. But I'm not going to pretend that he didn't do some positives in year 1, and to a lesser degree, year 2. And the "direction" comment was specifically centered around Franks hopefully emerging and what looks like a decent class.

It was an accomplishment by our defense to win the east twice. Not jim mclewain. What did he bring to the table? Someone asked me a few weeks ago if i thought mac was just a bystander through it all. Yes i do. He just happened to be the guy on the sidelines while a defense that will muschamp recruited carried us.
Also, i wouldn't put either of macs 1st two seasons on par with will muschamps 11 win season. Atleast we beat some great teams and had some blowouts.

Forget winning the East, there is no 2015 season without the significant moves McElwain made to address the OL. That's reality. We couldn't even hold a true Spring Game. Not to mention the contributions of guys like AC and Jefferson that year or Cleveland and Joseph last year. I'm not disputing that the defense hasn't carried us. But how is it that a defense that only got us to 4 & 7 wins in 2013 & 2014, could manage 10 a year later, with zero credit to the staff? And further, if we had such a great roster of players that could easily win the division, why were we routinely picked to finish in the bottom half of a weak East and fighting for bowl eligibility going into 2015?

As I said, I'm not giving some blanket support for the coaches. But to dispute that we made improvement from WM's last two years to 2015 is foolish. It only weakens the real arguments for why McElwain should be feeling the heat right now.

 

[Swamp Donkey]

. But to dispute that we made improvement from WM's last two years to 2015 is foolish. It only weakens the real arguments for why McElwain should be feeling the heat right now.

We made no improvements in fact we fell in BOTH offense and defense. That's a statistical reality.

All the "we gots us some playmakers now" stuff and "he rebuilt the roster stuff" fantasy. No one outside O&B pumperdom believes it and the objective measures (recruiting classes) dont support the argument.

 

[gatorkev85]

So I guess the quick slants. Perine's long run that ended in a fumble. Davis' long run that would've been a TD if not for an amazing play by a UT defender, and Frank's ability to see Cleveland come open and hit him perfectly in stride for the game winning TD means no progress to you. Alrighty then...

I'm sorry but we can all find plays that shows progress and that's nice, but it's all of the plays that show regress that makes everything come into perspective. It's kind like that saying even a blind squarl finds a nut every once in a while. Well even a terrible offense has a few good plays

 

[soflagator]

We made no improvements in fact we fell in BOTH offense and defense. That's a statistical reality.

All the "we gots us some playmakers now" stuff and "he rebuilt the roster stuff" fantasy. No one outside pf O&B pumperdom belueves it and the objective measures (recruiting classes) dont support the argument.

So my argument is strictly that 10 wins in a garbage division is greater than 6 wins in an equally garbage division(numerically proven). And your rebuttal is:

a) a partial statement taken out of context.
b) follow-up that contains manufactured statements that I've neither made nor supported.
c) conjecture that deviates to a side topic (recruiting) which is not only not part of this discussion, but is actually something that you and I have agreed on making it rather moot.

I don't know how well you know the judge, but it may not be too late to ask for a continuance here.

Don't like him,want him fired? Fine by me. Not a fan myself. Think he's ill equipped to take us to the next level? Pretty much right there with you. Think he's beginning to, and will continue to, face the music for his own recruiting errors? Yep, and it frustrates me to no end. None of that has anything to do with what I posted.

As I very succinctly stated, McElwain deserves some credit for bringing in certain players, specifically the OL, where we were bordering on a "cancel the season" level of problem. He also won close games in 2015 and 2016 that the previous regime had failed to do, which explains the 3 game difference in record. And he did so with the help of a handful of players that he, in fact, is responsible for. I'm really not sure why you and t are so insistent on taking this to the mat. It's not debatable, and again only weakens the real arguments against him. I expect you of all people to understand this.