NCAA: It's not our job to ensure educational quality

[GatorJ]

Here's to hoping that the NCAA crashes and burns...

"After years of making the case that the education of athletes is paramount, the NCAA now says it has no legal responsibility to make sure education is actually delivered."

http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/01/sport/ncaa-response-to-lawsuit/index.html

 

[ockgator]

Just like the teacher's unions..... They don't care about the kids unless they become dues paying teachers.... This from the then- union(NEA IIRC) prez mouth caught on tape a few years ago

 

[FatCatG8r]

Just like the teacher's unions..... They don't care about the kids unless they become dues paying teachers.... This from the then- union(NEA IIRC) prez mouth caught on tape a few years ago

A link and context are required for such statements to be considered more than opinion and conjecture .

The NCAA is nothing at all like a teachers' unions. Teachers' unions specifically are about representing professional teachers' interests. That they sometimes protect incompetent teachers is a mark against them; something that can be addressed with some rational thought and discussion rather than with the blunt object approach that has become the current right wing dogma of the day. But the fact is, most teachers are good teachers who (not that and thank you Ms Reiling, my 6th grade teacher, for teaching me the difference) endure terrible working conditions and ridiculously low pay for the love of teaching their students, and do so against the odds of top heavy administrations, poor funding and equally ridiculous state and federal testing mandates that require teaching to the test rather than teaching critical thinking and educating students about the world they live in, endure and continue to teach (a little bit of a run on sentence, but grammatically correct). I challenge you and all other anti-unionists to be so dedicated to your chosen profession.

Please note that you will find no misspelled words and no grammatically incorrect sentences in this post thanks to an excellent education received in Florida public schools. Note also that I almost never use spell check and I can diagram a sentence with little effort despite being 45 years removed from the public school system.

I now will go back to on topic issues. The NCAA has become exactly what the article says that it has, and as such, it has outlived it's stated purposes by abdication policies contrary to those purposes. It should be abolished and replaced by an American College Athletes Representative Institution (ACARI) that addresses all of the academic, athletic, medical and remuneration issues discussed in the article and more as the needs arise in the best interests of student athletes. Fans have their own resources, but may find advantages coming their way as a result of changes brought forward by a new body like the one suggested. Things like fair seating, better ticket prices and maybe even better athletic events are possible. There are no guarantees in life, but who knows?

This scenario is at best a difficult proposition. Perhaps a players union would be the best place to start. Then it could challenge the current corrupt institution, bring it down with lawsuits galore and then establish the new institution with a legally binding charter worded to accomplish all that has been discarded as too risky or costly (ie. revenue negative) by the NCAA.

Just sayin'.

 

[ockgator]

edit: My bad it was the union general counsel not the union president that said "Union dues, not education, are our top priority"



General Counsel Bob Chanin explains to NEA convention why Big Labor is so powerful:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-piPkgAUo0w[/youtube]

Despite what some among us would like to believe it is not because of our creative ideas; it is not because of the merit of our positions; it is not because we care about children; and it is not because we have a vision of a great public school for every child.
The NEA and its affiliates are effective advocates because we have power. And we have power because there are more than 3.2 million people who are willing to pay us hundreds of million of dollars in dues each year because they believe that we are the unions that can most effectively represent them; the union that can protect their rights and advance their interests as education employees.
This is not to say that the concern of NEA and its affiliates with closing achievement gaps, reducing drop rate rates, improving teacher quality, and the like are unimportant or inappropriate. To the contrary these are the goals that guide the work we do. But they need not and must not be achieved at the expense of due process, employee rights, or collective bargaining.
That is simply too high a price to pay.​

Where to begin? First of all, there is little that is voluntary about the millions in dues paid to the NEA every year. The NEA is strongest in states without right to work laws, and if you want to teach in a public school that is under an NEA contract in those jurisdictions (like California and New York), you must pay dues to the NEA. It is the law. There is nothing voluntary about it. Second, that is tax payer money he’s talking about, which is exactly what is so corrupting about public sector unions: the government is lobbying itself for its own expansion.
And what are “employee rights” and “due process,” you might ask? Well, those are what require New York City to pay 700 union teachers $65 million a year to do nothing. Same thing in Los Angeles, where 165 union teachers collect a total of $10 million a year from tax payers for doing nothing.
If you have the time, do watch the whole 25 minute address. Chanin recounts the rise of public sector collective bargaining, with a rapid rise in teacher unionization in the late 60s. He talks about all the victories the NEA has won for teachers since then. But ask yourselves, as the NEA has exploded in membership, budget, and power, how have American students fared? What have unions done for their education? Absolutely nothing.

Written by Conn Carroll in "The Daily Signal" July 9,2009

 

[stephenPE]

Bring this nonsense to the poli forum and I will explain it to you..........or listen to fatcat, he has a real clue about what teachers face now.

 

[GatorJ]

Keep it on topic. This is about the NCAA which has for years held its position and function is to maintain the students' educational integrity. And the moment a lawsuit calls out its failure to properly monitor and maintain its core function it disowns the responsibility.

It seems that its main function is to financially penalize educational institutions for small insignificant infractions and to lazily investigate corruption and hand out un-even penalties.

 

[WobbleGator]

The NCAA just needs to be shut down.

 

[Concrete Helmet]

Haven't any of you heard? The NCAA's only responsibility anymore is too make sure that some schools, and I use that term loosely, don't get caught cheating.....Bama AND FSUX are their top priorities and it's a lot of work, besides who has time for education with these "student athletes?

 

[PastyStoole]

edit: My bad it was the union general counsel not the union president that said "Union dues, not education, are our top priority"



General Counsel Bob Chanin explains to NEA convention why Big Labor is so powerful:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-piPkgAUo0w[/youtube]

Despite what some among us would like to believe it is not because of our creative ideas; it is not because of the merit of our positions; it is not because we care about children; and it is not because we have a vision of a great public school for every child.
The NEA and its affiliates are effective advocates because we have power. And we have power because there are more than 3.2 million people who are willing to pay us hundreds of million of dollars in dues each year because they believe that we are the unions that can most effectively represent them; the union that can protect their rights and advance their interests as education employees.
This is not to say that the concern of NEA and its affiliates with closing achievement gaps, reducing drop rate rates, improving teacher quality, and the like are unimportant or inappropriate. To the contrary these are the goals that guide the work we do. But they need not and must not be achieved at the expense of due process, employee rights, or collective bargaining.
That is simply too high a price to pay.​

Where to begin? First of all, there is little that is voluntary about the millions in dues paid to the NEA every year. The NEA is strongest in states without right to work laws, and if you want to teach in a public school that is under an NEA contract in those jurisdictions (like California and New York), you must pay dues to the NEA. It is the law. There is nothing voluntary about it. Second, that is tax payer money he’s talking about, which is exactly what is so corrupting about public sector unions: the government is lobbying itself for its own expansion.
And what are “employee rights” and “due process,” you might ask? Well, those are what require New York City to pay 700 union teachers $65 million a year to do nothing. Same thing in Los Angeles, where 165 union teachers collect a total of $10 million a year from tax payers for doing nothing.
If you have the time, do watch the whole 25 minute address. Chanin recounts the rise of public sector collective bargaining, with a rapid rise in teacher unionization in the late 60s. He talks about all the victories the NEA has won for teachers since then. But ask yourselves, as the NEA has exploded in membership, budget, and power, how have American students fared? What have unions done for their education? Absolutely nothing.

Written by Conn Carroll in "The Daily Signal" July 9,2009

I think FatCatG8r's point was that a pronoun following a person or persons should be "who" not "that." You missed it completely.

BTW, Florida teachers, union or non-union didn't receive a single raise or COLA adjustment for seven straight years. Tuition in private schools nearly doubled during that time as parents began trying to get their kids into better schools, and as the quality of teaching in public schools declined. Unions are really nothing more than part of natural market forces. Smart employers who are willing to pay wages that keep unions out of their shops succeed without having to deal with the burden of a union contract negotiation yolk. Most state governments are not smart employers and therefore have to deal with the unending burden of labor unions.

 

[GatorTAG]

This is nothing new. Prime examples are Dexter Manley(OSU), James Brooks (Auburn), Morris Claiborne (LSU), and Kevin Ross (Creighton), all graduated from high school and went to these institutes of higher learning despite being illiterate.

 

[NavetG8r]

What exactly is the NCAAs job? Sounds to me like they're getting more and more useless every day.

 

[WobbleGator]

What exactly is the NCAAs job? Sounds to me like they're getting more and more useless every day.

Almost like they are mods on a sports message board.

 

[NavetG8r]

Almost like they are mods on a sports message board.

:wobble:

 

[TLB]

I can't see the NCAA reaching into universities to address the quality of the education provided - that would reside with the accreditation entities for the colleges. I can see the NCAA doing what it has done, in terms of requiring attendance and passing grades in order to play. But it is up to the individual to choose which courses to study - signing up for fake classes falls on the school for allowing them to be offered and on the student for deciding that was what they wanted to 'learn', not the NCAA. I could see the UNC law suit going after UNC, not NCAA. I'll concede the NCAA regulations foster an environment where athletic, but less educated/capable kids end up with worthless degrees, but I can see the NCAA saying "IF you play for a school, you NEED to be using the opportunity to get an education". Courses offered and chosen remain in the realm of school and student. Honestly, do you hear about non-football/basketball kids having these issues? Typically not, as they are indeed using their athleticism to get a scholarship that provides them an education for future career opportunities. No sympathy for kids who failed to seize the opportunity that was presented.

For me, this goes along with NCAA recognizing it's scope of authority, as they learned they over reached in the Sandusky case, and have had other similar situations of exerting jurisdiction in areas they have no responsibility or authority. The NCAA has a limited scope, IMO, and this law suit is trying to hold them accountable outside that scope. What strikes me is that I believe the NCAA is a self created entity, or perhaps it was created by the schools originally (to hold one another to a common standard). However, with the Power 5 breaking away, along with NCAA's ineffectiveness in the past decade, I truly see the demise of the NCAA on the horizon. Power 5 will build their own entity to police each other how they see fit, the other 5 will do whatever they need to do (perhaps stay under the NCAA wings) and the lower divisions either stay under NCAA or create their own divisional entities. But in all, we won't see the NCAA running investigations that take years, nor issuing punishments (inside, or outside, their jurisdiction) with much effect. They have become obsolete.

 

[Double Gator Dad]

Off and On topic:
- Teachers are caught in a crossfire of political agendas. Teachers unions that only want more money and power and parents who want no ownership of their children's education. Teachers cannot overcome the real challenge in education - BAD PARENTING. If the unions really cared they would be trumpeting this fact versus constantly screaming for more salary and benefits. You can pay a teacher six figures but they cannot overcome bad parents.
- The NCAA is becoming more of a joke by the day. Help me understand how fraudulently keeping athletes eligible for competition (UNC) is outside of their scope? If this is not their role, then neither is paying players or buying their parents.

 

[rogdochar]

But the NCAA makes more money when the sports product gathers maximum TV watchability ?

 

[GatorJ]

Almost like they are mods on a sports message board.