Foley's larger failure: Facilities or Butters?

Gatorraid81 · Apr 26, 2018

Good ole Foley, got us light years behind all other major programs in facilities. Managed to lose not one, but 2 sure fire HOF football coaches under his tenure, and made 3 bad football hires as well. How has Foley not managed to get more public criticism for his failures?

Durfish · Apr 26, 2018

The biggest failure related to Foley?

Offering him the AD job in the first place.

78 · Apr 26, 2018

gatorkev85 said:
I'm sick of hearing this bull crap the man started the season every year with 4 cupcakes and had UK as his cross rival. That's 5 wins that should be in the bag before the season even starts. So to win 8 games they need to win 3 games out of Bama, Auburn, LSU, Arky, Ole Miss, A&M and whoever is from the East. I see Ole Miss, A&M, and Arky around the same as Miss St so it's not that hard to get to 8 wins. They had 8 wins in 2007 Miss St so it's not like it never had been done. Plus Miss St is still a doorstep they only finished in the top half of the West once under Mullen. Every other year he finished 4th or worse in the west that makes you a doorstep still.

Now I am concerned. A doorstep is at least one step lower than a doormat.

SeabeeGator · Apr 26, 2018

BruceWayne said:
For the guys in this thread that are already totally sold on Mullen...when are you ever gonna learn? Can't we just wait and see on the guy? It's not a homerun hire. He has done almost everything right since being here. That's the only thing I'm impressed with so far. It's always gotta be "what have you done for me lately" here. It's UF. There's a standard. He has to prove himself all over again. What he did at Miss. St wasn't all that impressive.

I haven’t seen anyone totally sold on him. I’ve seen a mix of “wait and see” and “bad hire”. I think you’re confusing the “wait and see” folks because they are being positive about what he’s done this spring.

Swamp Donkey · Apr 26, 2018

'78 said:
I could easily say the same about your reply. A month and a half ago, before you took smart pills, you backed the hire.

A month and a half ago Mullinz was running around to recruits with Jujuan Seider finishing a great early signing.

Instead of promoting Seider to Recruiting Coordinator, Mullinz looked in the mirror told himself he had suddenly become a great recruiter, ran Seider off and hired his buddy Greg Knox Nord Part 2.

Creyer hired a whole staff full of great recruiters a whole staff full of Jujuan Seiders, many of whom were great recruiters but not great position coaches. Seider should have been an easy choice bc he also happens to be an elite position coach. Our two true freshman being immediately ready to play last year and the improved blocking across the running back position group proved that was not just a myth. Seider's reputation was well-earned. He had top teams.throwing money at him the second he was pushed aside.

Mullinz apparently didnt learn the lesson that you live or die w recruiting. Recruiting fell apart the second they ran Seider off. In the end that will probably be the decision which gets fired.

He better fix recruiting and in a gdd damn hurry or he's not going to make it. They "maybe we will start recruiting four years from now plan" didnt work for Butters either. How do you fix your staff in May? I dont know.

smh We ran off Seider and Dorian Gray in the last two years. Insane.

78 · Apr 26, 2018

Swamp Donkey said:
A month and a half ago Mullinz was running around to recruits with Jujuan Seider finishing a great early signing.

Instead of promoting Seider to Recruiting Coordinator, Mullinz looked in the mirror told himself he had suddenly become a great recruiter, ran Seider off and hired his buddy Greg Knox Nord Part 2.

Creyer hired a whole staff full of great recruiters a whole staff full of Jujuan Seiders, many of whom were great recruiters but not great position coaches. Seider should have been an easy choice bc he also happens to be an elite position coach. Our two true freshman being immediately ready to play last year and the improved blocking across the running back position group proved that was not just a myth. Seider's reputation was well-earned. He had top teams.throwing money at him the second he was pushed aside.

Mullinz apparently didnt learn the lesson that you live or die w recruiting. In the end that will probably be the decision which got fired.

he better fix recruiting and in a gdd damn hurry or he's not going to make it. How do you fix your staff in May? I dont know.

He opted for family over performance, which frankly concerns me, too.

Swamp Donkey · Apr 26, 2018

'78 said:
He opted for family over performance, which frankly concerns me, too.

He could brought family anyway, just made him TE coach. Knord as been a TE coach before. Show Seider some love for doing an amazing job w early signing, throw $50k or $100k at him or maybe make him RC if you somehow insist on moving him. SOMETHING. We came in at much less than the advertised budget that Mullinz supposedly negotiated for his staff anyway.

We should have thrown a little at Dorian Gray also. He was an acknowledged elite recruiter and one of the few who was also an acknowledged elite position coach, so we gave him the smallest salary on the staff and threw $400k more at Nord and $800k PER YEAR more (and a two year extension) at fvkking Nussdrunk.

WTF is going on in our AD? There is no excuse for being so detached and clueless.

soflagator · Apr 26, 2018

Slevin said:
I think Ol Quiverlips was a bigger failure. At least Muschamp was a known good recruiter and HCIW for a p5 school in Texas. It was a coop at the time to get him to leave. We plucked Meyer from Notre Dame and Muschamp from Texas, two true blue bloods. Nobody wanted the guy whos smile out-glowed the canister of ooz from TMNT.

The stupidity is subjective and interchangeable. The WM hire in itself has some merit. The manner in which Foley arrogantly handled the search, especially considering his prospect's significant ties to our two biggest rivals, was the problem. AD's all over the country would kill to have a year's notice to find a replacement, coming off an undefeated regular season, a year removed from a NC, and the aura of Tebow. With that time, we should've been able to land virtually whoever we wanted. Settling for an unproven, regardless of his "title" at UT, was ridiculous. In many respects, the whole HCIW is thing is the equivalent to being engaged for months with no set date determined. It's "yeah, I don't want to lose you, but I'm not quite sure I want you either". But again, given a more demanding time constraint, I'd be more inclined to respect the hire. As it is, JF admittedly made up his mind on a gut feeling and went back to playing Words With Friends.

By the time we were circling the drain in late 2014, narrowly avoiding a second losing season in as many years, and sitting with a 100+ ranked recruiting class, I'm not sure we were going to hire anyone much better than JM. The hire sucked, and it's easy to see that now. But we were already a beaten down shell of a program, and that is a direct result of WM and his insistence that we rewrite UF football history and change the very things that had made us successful for 20+ years.

In short, a spurned bulldog-alum elected to burn UF to the ground. And then a career journeyman stood by carelessly, pouring BBQ sauce on the smoldering disaster.

They both belong in prison.

oxrageous · Apr 26, 2018

Now Law is saying recruiting sucked after being complimentary on the class for weeks?

jhbyrd · Apr 26, 2018

Slevin said:
Facilities. Derick Hunter who is an idiot, but he just visited georgia and said he liked florida, but georgia is just on another level with what they are doing.

Player dorms are small prison boxes. Foley was a cheap pos who used 99% of football revenue for non revenue sports. Sure he built a powerhouse Athletic department but football has suffered for a decade because of it.

Foley did not set the UF 100 million dollar debt limit he just had to live within it. Our competition (not UGA) has higher debt limits. Foley had to pay cash for the Oconnell center major renovation with no debt at the same time the University was doing a major fund raiser for the school's endowment.

Looks like UF has raised its debt limit to 150 million seeing that we are issuing bonds for 50 million for the current 130 million dollar expansion. Foley did all the unpopular stuff first which will make Stricklin look good as he fund raises for the more popular projects.

Our top tier athlete academic center that Foley spearheaded is needed at a more difficult academic school like UF. It is not as popular.

The Oconnell center is harder to fund raise for than football.

The good news is that when UF completes its Football center UF will have great facilities that are close to the stadium. Bama's are not close to the stadium.

UGA and UF are the most conservative SEC programs debt wise. If there is a recession our 2 schools will fair much better than the debt loaded schools.

UGA has a recent lead on UF because UF has to move the baseball stadium to have a more efficient long term football center. After the football center is completed they have room to put a new dorm right in front of the football center increasing player convenience. UF has set a great long term plan but we must wait.

Most people don't realize that Foley had a debt limit that he was given. Foley took the heat on that. Stricklin will be the beneficiary as he inherited a financially strong balance sheet.

Foley failed hiring Saban coaches Mac and Muschamp but he did close Meyer. Wish he got Mullen earlier. During his career Foley was the only AD who hired all 3 of Football, Basketball and Baseball national champ coaches.

GatorJ · Apr 26, 2018

oxrageous said:
Now Law is saying recruiting sucked after being complimentary on the class for weeks?

You know that Law plays both sides just in case. He was the biggest Mac lover when Mac was hired.

Now I’ll give him credit in that he turned on Mac relatively quick – as did a lot of us – but Law does like to play it safe.

Here’s the deal: Mullen was an OK hire. He’s reconnecting the fan base, previous players, and the boosters which was needed because Mac wrecked all that.

However, I don’t think we will ever be a championship team under him. His offense requires a 6’3, 240lb QB Who can take immense punishment. Unless he alters his offense significantly, it’s an offense that can be shut down with elite linebackers and DEs Who can contain.

There were about five coaches I would’ve taken above him. And they were all coaches we could’ve gotten.

He is a significant upgrade over Mac and Chump. I don’t think Stricklin panicked when choosing him. I think he chose him because he was familiar with him and he thought the program needed a shot in the arm to reengage all aspects. And that is something that Mullen can do.

I suspect that we will win the East a few times and probably win the SEC once or twice under him over the next 10 years. Will probably be in the playoffs two or three times. I don’t think we will win any national championships.

And yes, I expect him to be here a decade. I think he may very well be our Mark Richt.

I really hope that I am wrong.

But I do think Florida football will be fun again.

78 · Apr 26, 2018

Swamp Donkey said:
He could brought family anyway, just made him TE coach. He jas been a TE coach before. Show Seider some love for doing an amazing job w early signing, throw $50k or $100k at him or maybe make him RC if you.somehow insist on moving him. SOMETHING. We came in at much less than the advertised budget that Mullinz supposedly negotiated for his staff anyway.

We should have thrown a little at Dorian Gray also. He was an acknowledged elite recruiter and one of the few who was also an acknowledged elite position coach, so we gave him the smallest salary on the staff and threw $400k more at Nord and $800k PER YEAR more (and a two year extension) at fvkking Nussdrunk.

WTF is going on in our AD? There is no excuse for being so detached and clueless.

On the surface it looks questionable, but we can't pretend to know everything that went on behind the scenes.

Thowing more money at it had to come from Mullen first. If it didn't, which appears to be the case, then it's really outside the AD's wheelhouse.

78 · Apr 26, 2018

GatorJ said:
You know that Law plays both sides just in case. He was the biggest Mac lover when Mac was hired.

Now I’ll give him credit in that he turned on Mac relatively quick – as did a lot of us – but Law does like to play it safe.

Here’s the deal: Mullen was an OK hire. He’s reconnecting the fan base, previous players, and the boosters which was needed because Mac wrecked all that.

However, I don’t think we will ever be a championship team under him. His offense requires a 6’3, 240lb QB Who can take immense punishment. Unless he alters his offense significantly, it’s an offense that can be shut down with elite linebackers and DEs Who can contain.

There were about five coaches I would’ve taken above him. And they were all coaches we could’ve gotten.

He is a significant upgrade over Mac and Chump. I don’t think Stricklin panicked when choosing him. I think he chose him because he was familiar with him and he thought the program needed a shot in the arm to reengage all aspects. And that is something that Mullen can do.

I suspect that we will win the East a few times and probably win the SEC once or twice under him over the next 10 years. Will probably be in the playoffs two or three times. I don’t think we will win any national championships.

And yes, I expect him to be here a decade. I think he may very well be our Mark Richt.

I really hope that I am wrong.

But I do think Florida football will be fun again.

That sums up my feelings. I know we'll be improved, I just don't know how much.

lizardbreath · Apr 26, 2018

Back to the original question of which was worse - neglecting the facilities or hiring McElweenie. That's like deciding if it's worse to be shot in the head with a Colt or Smith & Wesson.

Swamp Donkey · Apr 26, 2018

oxrageous said:
Now Law is saying recruiting sucked after being complimentary on the class for weeks?

No.... I was very happy with the early signing period. We fizzled at the second signing period, sad bc it was self inflicted stupidity, and are duds right now.

Try to keep up Ox. I know nuances are difficult for some of you.

Swamp Donkey · Apr 26, 2018

GatorJ said:
You know that Law plays both sides just in case. He was the biggest Mac lover when Mac was hired.

Sorry but that is absolute bullshyt. I expect it from a cokehead like concrete, not from you.

In the words of Sofla, I wasnt to criticize that moron bc I needed to sit this one out.

I tired to be on the Dwagchump train, especially when he talked about an attacking multiple offense. So hilarious in retrospect. I feel like an idiot for buying that. I guess I can understand how Fooley bought it too.

Though I didnt LIKE either a Dwag running defense or a Cheeseburglar running the offense, I did expected them to be successful I admit. Early 2012 was as far as I could ride that train.

As for Mullinz, Ive disliked him since the beginning, like 05. Did I think we really did well in early signing? Sure. Overall was it a pretty good first class? Probably the best weve had, admittedly, but primarily on the strength of the early signing and momentum is definitely going the wrong way. Actually there is no momentum at all. We are at a standstill. Can we recover? Maybe.

Do I dislike him? not as much as I did. He has done some good things and seems to recognize the problems.

Do I think he is the answer? Hell no. Would be in my first 50 choices? Hell no.

GatorJ · Apr 26, 2018

Swamp Donkey said:
Sorry but that is absolute bullshyt. I expect it from a cokehead like concrete, not from you.

In the words of Sofla, I wasnt to criticize that moron bc I needed to sit this one out.

I tired to be on the Dwagchump train, especially when he talked about an attacking multiple offense. So hilarious in retrospect. Though I didnt LIKE either a Dwag running defense or a Cheeseburglar running the offense, I did expect them to be successful I admit. Early 2012 was as far as I could ride that train.

Lol.

Now see, that’s why you’re my favorite poster.

ChiefGator · Apr 26, 2018

Throwing money at anything usually does not accomplish the actual goal. We have long had a debt cap and a desire to be great at every sport. Title Nine added several women's sports which cost money, but were both required and since they both win a lot and perform in the classroom were a great thing.

Just my take!

Swamp Donkey · Apr 26, 2018

jhbyrd said:
If there is a recession our 2 schools will fair much better...

Yeah the Florida Marlins and Cincinnati Reds use the same method, except there was a recession and none of the Bammers or Yankees of the world were affected innthe slightest.

Choosing not to compete and the resultant 1/2 to 3/4 empty stadium creates a recession for the slumlord teams every year.

Foley's larger failure: Facilities or Butters?

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