Casino "investing"

BMF · Jun 18, 2019

I'm going to Vegas on June 30th for a week. A buddy is turning 50 and we're going to celebrate - just a boys trip! We're going on a full day white water rafting trip on Tuesday, but other than that it'll be mostly pool time, beer drinking....and "investing" (blackjack).

I usually only play blackjack and I'm cheap. I generally get up about $50 to $100 and walk away. I've lost my ass before, but as I've gotten older and more disciplined I usually win small amounts.

Anybody have "investing" stories to share? Strategies? Recommendations?

Gator By Marriage · Jun 18, 2019

Back before we were married, Mrs G. and I were on a cruise and went to the casino. She had no cash on her and asked to "borrow" $20 to play a little black jack (it was her first time in a casino by the way), while I played craps. After awhile of pretty much breaking even, I gave up and went looking for her. I finally found her at the cashier with a stack of chips. "It's $180" she told me all excitedly. Of course as we weren't married yet, all I got was my $20 back. In 25+ plus years of marriage, she has never again won in a casino.......

bradgator2 · Jun 18, 2019

Not a huge fan of casino gambling. But as dumb as it sounds... I have the most fun at a computerized bubble craps game. We'll park there all nights, enjoy our free drinks, and have a table that is just as loud as the real craps table.

It is real dice so real craps. The dice get "rolled" by shooting off a bouncing platform that the shooter gets to control. But the real beauty is the scoring and betting are all computerized. And you are sitting in a circular pattern. There is no "pressure" that comes from a real table. No worrying about partial bet payouts and whether or not the dealer just screwed you.

no1g8r · Jun 18, 2019

I like the way you put "invest" in quotes. Lots of folks gamble in the stock market, but no one truly invests while gaming in casinos.

I've had some strategies that I've made money with, but whenever I created spreadsheets that randomized outcomes (dice rolls, roulette spins, etc), over time every strategy has lost money. Some work fairly well for extending the length of time I get to take advantage of free food and drink, but in simulations, all lose money.

That said, I've walked out of casinos with up to thousands of their money on multiple occasions, and over the long haul, I'm well ahead. But it is because after working up the simulations, I realized I was lucky, and hardly ever play anymore.

BMF · Jun 18, 2019

no1g8r said:
I like the way you put "invest" in quotes. Lots of folks gamble in the stock market, but no one truly invests while gaming in casinos.

I've had some strategies that I've made money with, but whenever I created spreadsheets that randomized outcomes (dice rolls, roulette spins, etc), over time every strategy has lost money. Some work fairly well for extending the length of time I get to take advantage of free food and drink, but in simulations, all lose money.

That said, I've walked out of casinos with up to thousands of their money on multiple occasions, and over the long haul, I'm well ahead. But it is because after working up the simulations, I realized I was lucky, and hardly ever play anymore.

I think the key is to walk away. Sure, you could hang out and get on a heater and walk out w/ over $1000+, but you could just as easily lose your ass. Once I started walking w/ a modest win is when I started "winning". My wife gets so mad because she wants to hang out and play for a while. I look at her and say, "I just doubled my buy-in, I'm out." She'll usually hang out for another half hour and lose everything she started with. I'm not saying I "always" win, because that would be BS. But over the last several years I've done well w/ the "walk away" strategy. I'm sometimes at the table for less than 15 minutes - hell, usually it's less than 30 minutes. We played in Philly on Saturday night for about 15 minutes and won $95 on a $100 buy in.

I have an online sportsbook account that I have always referred to as "sports investing". I've managed to hover around $900 to $1200 in that account for the last 15 years or so.

Gator by the Sea · Jun 18, 2019

It was the last night of a Vegas trip several years ago and I was going to call it a night and head back to the room. I was satisfied with way the gambling had gone—only down about $100 for the week, playing blackjack, roulette, and craps. As I headed for the elevator, I put my hand in my pocket and felt a chip there. Not wanting to leave with a chip, I walked over to the nearest roulette table and put it down on 7, expecting to watch one spin of the wheel and head up to bed. To my surprise, it landed on my number. So, naturally I had to play another spin. And another, and another... until I finally went to bed a couple hours later with $300 dollars in my pocket. That one lucky chip turned a -$100 week into a +$200 week. Needless to say, 7 has always been, and will always be my lucky number.

Gator By Marriage · Jun 18, 2019

BMF said:
I think the key is to walk away. Sure, you could hang out and get on a heater and walk out w/ over $1000+, but you could just as easily lose your ass. Once I started walking w/ a modest win is when I started "winning".

Old adage: Pigs get fat; hogs get slaughtered.

BMF · Jun 19, 2019

Gator by the Sea said:
It was the last night of a Vegas trip several years ago and I was going to call it a night and head back to the room. I was satisfied with way the gambling had gone—only down about $100 for the week, playing blackjack, roulette, and craps. As I headed for the elevator, I put my hand in my pocket and felt a chip there. Not wanting to leave with a chip, I walked over to the nearest roulette table and put it down on 7, expecting to watch one spin of the wheel and head up to bed. To my surprise, it landed on my number. So, naturally I had to play another spin. And another, and another... until I finally went to bed a couple hours later with $300 dollars in my pocket. That one lucky chip turned a -$100 week into a +$200 week. Needless to say, 7 has always been, and will always be my lucky number.

Nice story. I've never been that lucky.

I was in South Lake Tahoe about 10 years ago w/ some buddies. We got hammered (it was St. Patty's Day and one of the guys birthdays). I lost the group so I sat down at a blackjack table near the exit/entrance figuring they'd walk by sooner or later. I figured I'd play the $5 table and it wouldn't be too bad if I lost. I ended up around $200 after close to an hour (and four or five more beers)....I never saw the guys. I walked back to the room - they were already in bed. When they woke up I told them I won $200 and I bought breakfast the next morning.

GR8 2B · Jun 19, 2019

Blackjack is the only casino game in which the odds favor the better, by just a fraction of a point. This only applies at those tables that offer you the opportunity to double down on a split

no1g8r · Jun 19, 2019

GR8 2B said:
Blackjack is the only casino game in which the odds favor the better, by just a fraction of a point. This only applies at those tables that offer you the opportunity to double down on a split

That brings the odds down closer to in favor of the dealer, down to about 0.5% if a blackjack player employs perfect strategy, but odds still favor the dealer.

A card counter can swing odds into his favor slightly, but casinos make thus much more difficult by using multiple decks (usually dealing from a 6-deck shoe) and adding more decks to the shoe before all cards in the shoe have been dealt (with about 1/3 of the shoe remaining, or about 2 decks worth).

When casinos do advertise single deck blackjack, they take care of odds swinging to the card counter by adjusting the table rules and only paying 6:5 on a blackjack instead of 3:2, or by not allowing splits or double downs.

For a player that is winging it, without applying strategy (which is just a set of rules to follow based on the situation), odds are around 8% in favor of the House. That house edge comes from the fact that the player always plays before the House. There is a 28 percent chance that either the player or the dealer will bust. Combined there is an 8% chance that both dealer and player would bust, but the dealer doesn’t have to play out to bust if the player busts first.

GatorInGeorgia · Jun 21, 2019

My best advice.

1) always split Aces & 8’s
2) always double down when the rules tell you to
3) find 2 or 3 more all day excursions to get you out of the casino-6 days in a Vegas casino is an eternity, especially if you lose early. Excursions may end up being much cheaper :lol:

Politigator · Jun 26, 2019

GR8 2B said:
Blackjack is the only casino game in which the odds favor the better, by just a fraction of a point. This only applies at those tables that offer you the opportunity to double down on a split

The odds only favor bettor if you are a card counter. However you can get very close to 50% at the right tables.

Generally blackjack and video poker (if the payout ratios are good) have the best odds. Slots are mostly terrible. The basic rolls in craps approach 50% but you burn through money really fast in craps.

Gatorbait25 · Jun 27, 2019

In the AM you should have no problem finding $10 blackjack tables. Depending
on where you stay you might even be able to even find a $5 table. In the evening on the other
hand $20, $50 and up seems to be the standard. If you like to play poker then the Bellagio is a
must. Avoid Park MGM (The old Monte Carlo) . I stayed there over last March madness, and won't
be staying there again. Like you, I tend to walk away after I've double my money. In most cases
I drop $100, and when I get up to $220 I toss the dealer a chip and walk away. Typically after
receiving a fresh cocktail of course. Good luck BMF!

Gatorbait25 · Jun 27, 2019

As far as strategy goes try to find a nearly full table, and take a seat. I've found it's difficult
to bust the dealer the less they get into the deck. I've lost quite a bit more than I've won
playing solo against the dealer at 5 AM.

Bushmaster · Jun 27, 2019

You can't build a $2 billion casino if you are losing money.

BMF · Jun 28, 2019

Gatorbait25 said:
In the AM you should have no problem finding $10 blackjack tables. Depending
on where you stay you might even be able to even find a $5 table. In the evening on the other
hand $20, $50 and up seems to be the standard. If you like to play poker then the Bellagio is a
must. Avoid Park MGM (The old Monte Carlo) . I stayed there over last March madness, and won't
be staying there again. Like you, I tend to walk away after I've double my money. In most cases
I drop $100, and when I get up to $220 I toss the dealer a chip and walk away. Typically after
receiving a fresh cocktail of course. Good luck BMF!

I like finding $10 tables for sure. But on the other hand, you can win (or lose) very quickly on a $25 table. I've played for less than 10 minutes on $25 tables and walked away with more than double buy-in. The problem on a $25 table is if you buy in for $100 it can be gone 4 hands later. I usually buy in for $200 on a $25 table (and $100 on a $10 table). A $10 table can take a little time to get up $100.

I head out Sunday, probably won't do much gambling until after the white water rafting trip on Tuesday. We're staying at a Marriott near the convention center for the first three nights (on purpose so we don't do any heavy drinking/stupid sh*t before the white water trip)...then we move to the MGM for July 3rd thru Sunday.

And - sage advise on getting a fresh cocktail before leaving the table!

Gatorbait25 · Jun 28, 2019

BMF said:
I like finding $10 tables for sure. But on the other hand, you can win (or lose) very quickly on a $25 table. I've played for less than 10 minutes on $25 tables and walked away with more than double buy-in. The problem on a $25 table is if you buy in for $100 it can be gone 4 hands later. I usually buy in for $200 on a $25 table (and $100 on a $10 table). A $10 table can take a little time to get up $100.

I head out Sunday, probably won't do much gambling until after the white water rafting trip on Tuesday. We're staying at a Marriott near the convention center for the first three nights (on purpose so we don't do any heavy drinking/stupid sh*t before the white water trip)...then we move to the MGM for July 3rd thru Sunday.

And - sage advise on getting a fresh cocktail before leaving the table!

Good point on the $25 table. I prefer to have at least ten times the minimum when I take a seat for blackjack.

BMF · Jul 2, 2019

I'm in Vegas now, got here yesterday, haven't done any "investing" yet. We go on the rafting trip tomorrow morning. Just saw Mystere at Treasure Island. Had a great day yesterday after we got here. I met a couple from New Orleans at the Encore pool, the wife had an LSU hat on - I was wearing a Gators hat. Long story short, they live here in Vegas and the guy is a partner in a restaurant group. He hooked us up w dinner at one of his restaurants nearby and the whole thing was free.

Today we went to the Encore pool again and I started talking to an absolute smokin hot classy lady w mega-cannon fake breasts....we started chatting and she says she's moved a lot, and just moved to Miami from Tuscaloosa. Her name is Jane Enos, Dan Enos' wife (the OC for Miami). We talked for another half hour. I told her I'm a college football nut. Really nice lady, classy and hot AF.

NVGator · Jul 4, 2019

BMF said:
Today we went to the Encore pool again and I started talking to an absolute smokin hot classy lady w mega-cannon fake breasts....we started chatting and she says she's moved a lot, and just moved to Miami from Tuscaloosa. Her name is Jane Enos, Dan Enos' wife (the OC for Miami). We talked for another half hour. I told her I'm a college football nut. Really nice lady, classy and hot AF.

Did you ask her for a titty shot?

Thick&ThinG8r · Jul 5, 2019

I'm not sure of the odds but, a low stress game that's actually fun when with a group of people is pai gow. Usually lots of ladies at the table with a low buy in. Maybe let the wife give it a try.

Casino "investing"

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