CBN on Josh Pate’s the Late Kick on Tuesday

Altitude Gator

Lurking from Altitude
Lifetime Member
Aug 23, 2017
3,308
6,990
I don’t think he’s done a bad job with construction of the program. There was a lot of cleaning up to do after Mullen’s lazy azz left.

But Mullen and Napier are exact opposites. Mullen excelled only on the field and was lazy off the field which led to the foundation crumbling. And Napier excels off the field and sucks on the field.
Exactly how does he excel off the field? Bureaucracy building?
 

GatorJ

Founding Member
Hopeful
Moderator
Jun 11, 2014
21,199
34,112
Founding Member
Exactly how does he excel off the field? Bureaucracy building?
I think he’s built a pretty good culture. And I think we have a significantly better nutrition and training program than we had under Mullen. I also think that he has done a pretty good job with NIL considering all the ineptitude around him. I think the balancing of the roster is better and I think that we may have one of the deepest teams we’ve had in a long time.

But seriously, who cares about any of that? Particularly if we’re not winning? I just don’t understand why we can’t get somebody who knows how to run a program and how to win on Saturdays. It’s always one or the other.

Chump could build a defense, but not an offense.

Butters was really really good at identifying under the radar talent, but he couldn’t bring in any top tier talent. And as much as we banged on him, we wouldn’t have an IPF or any movement toward the all in one facility if it wasn’t for him.

Mullen could coach on game day, but he literally stunk everywhere else.
 

GatorJ

Founding Member
Hopeful
Moderator
Jun 11, 2014
21,199
34,112
Founding Member
If there’s any silver lining to Napier, it’s the fact that we were probably the youngest team in all of college football last year. This is a much more experienced team. We now need to see whether that translates on the field.

It might…

We are the best we’ve been at quarterback in a decade.

We are the deepest we’ve been at linebacker in a decade.

We are the best we’ve been at running back in probably almost 20 years.

We are probably the deepest we’ve been on the DL since Chump. But pass rush is nonexistent.

The defensive backfield is pretty disastrous.

We have a talent at wide receiver that may be the best since the Spurrier era. But we have no depth there. We need a receiver from the portal so bad.

Edit: OL is disastrous.

So we’ll see…
 

GatorJ

Founding Member
Hopeful
Moderator
Jun 11, 2014
21,199
34,112
Founding Member
Btw, this is for @Swamp Donkey - I just read an article with On3. Pup Howard led the spring game and tackles. Led the scrimmages in tackles as well. And had a quote from Shemar James saying that he was a monster and huge.

I think he’s listed at 6’4, 250 pounds.
 

Durty South Swamp

Founding Member
doodley doodley doo!
Lifetime Member
Jun 19, 2014
21,700
48,772
Founding Member
Napier excels off the field
i think this narrative is complete and utter garbage. he hasnt excelled at anything "off the field." the facilities upgrades had nothing to do with him and were being done no matter who the next HC was. i dont credit anything positive to him assembling 100+ "staffers" to do whatever it is they do (because no one knows and no one can define it) when mullen had no one and was lazy with equal results in some cases, and much better results in others. all this moron has done is quintupled the pay roll, halved the wins, and eviscerated the hope.

he doesnt excel at anything.
 

GatorJ

Founding Member
Hopeful
Moderator
Jun 11, 2014
21,199
34,112
Founding Member
i think this narrative is complete and utter garbage. he hasnt excelled at anything "off the field." the facilities upgrades had nothing to do with him and were being done no matter who the next HC was. i dont credit anything positive to him assembling 100+ "staffers" to do whatever it is they do (because no one knows and no one can define it) when mullen had no one and was lazy with equal results in some cases, and much better results in others. all this moron has done is quintupled the pay roll, halved the wins, and eviscerated the hope.

he doesnt excel at anything.
I get it. We definitely haven’t seen any results on the field. And I’m not trying to convince you. I think the program is almost a 180° from Mullen. In both ways. 180° on the field. And 180° off the field.

But I do 100% agree that none of it matters if we don’t win on the field.
 

TheDouglas78

Founding Member
Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 12, 2014
16,362
14,847
Founding Member
What were his thoughts last year? Darkhorse NC contender as I recall?
Pate was very pro Napier last year, even excusing the losses because he had a top 5 class coming in. He is very pro-Napier overall, because of his off -field work. And as much as I don't think Napier is the right fit overall, the amount of change that has happened staffing wise and organizationally to modernize the organization is obviously there. These are changes that have been asked for by two of the last three coaching, Mullen was ok with coasting.

The problem with Napier is coaching and game day. Urban wasn't the best football mind, but he brought in guys smarter than him on their perspective sides of the ball. We need Napier to do the same.
 

GatorTruth133

Alethea
Lifetime Member
Oct 5, 2017
2,332
6,333
If there’s any silver lining to Napier, it’s the fact that we were probably the youngest team in all of college football last year. This is a much more experienced team. We now need to see whether that translates on the field.

It might…

We are the best we’ve been at quarterback in a decade.

We are the deepest we’ve been at linebacker in a decade.

We are the best we’ve been at running back in probably almost 20 years.

We are probably the deepest we’ve been on the DL since Chump. But pass rush is nonexistent.

The defensive backfield is pretty disastrous.

We have a talent at wide receiver that may be the best since the Spurrier era. But we have no depth there. We need a receiver from the portal so bad.

Edit: OL is disastrous.

So we’ll see…
QB? Maybe. Need to see the QB win games against good defenses. Hard to argue right now based on potential it is better than Trask, EJ, and AR in the room in 2020.
LB? Yes.
RB in 20 years? I have to see production. I'll take Perine/Scarlett, KT/Scarlett, Pierce and friends, until I see it. MJ is solid, but not sure he has the ceiling of some of the past. Beyond that, we are projecting on spring. Not saying it won't be, but I've heard the Lingard, Bowman, and other hype over the last decade only for it not to produce on Saturdays.
DL since Champ? Yes. Pass rush might be better, if not, I think it's an indictment from the top down. 3 years of recruiting classes and transfers needs to show.
DB? Again, year 3, indictment top down if not excellent this year with all that experience.
WR since Spurrier era? I'd take a step back. I'm not sure right now we match Jefferson, Swain, Grimes, Toney, Hammond, Cleveland, and Copeland (based on then potential like much of what we have currently) in 2018. I would really have to be crazy to say at this point it tops Percy, Baker, and Caldwell in '06 or the '08 guys.

With that said, I do take the same stance that Napier has done a lot more good off the field for things like housing, parking, recruiting (though still not where it must be), etc. than many will credit.

That said, this year is put up or shut up. 0 and I mean 0 excuses not to be 6-1 at worst heading into Jacksonville if he is the coach people have been hyping. I've said it before, will say it again, Miami is bad, Samford should be fireable if a loss, aTm lost a lot from that '22 class and first SEC game on the road for Elko, MSU 3rd staff in 3 years, UCF should never win in the Swamp (especially after a bye), and being 0-3 against Kentucky would be objectively failure.

Then you have to get at least 1 of LSU or FSU with the major rebuilds both programs are undertaking this season. And you can't be blown out a single time. I really don't thing that is asking a lot from a team with a 6th year QB, returning and adding a ton of "snaps" as Nape has used as a catchphrase for 2 off-seasons, and for a team with 7 home games.
 

GatorJ

Founding Member
Hopeful
Moderator
Jun 11, 2014
21,199
34,112
Founding Member
QB? Maybe. Need to see the QB win games against good defenses. Hard to argue right now based on potential it is better than Trask, EJ, and AR in the room in 2020.
LB? Yes.
RB in 20 years? I have to see production. I'll take Perine/Scarlett, KT/Scarlett, Pierce and friends, until I see it. MJ is solid, but not sure he has the ceiling of some of the past. Beyond that, we are projecting on spring. Not saying it won't be, but I've heard the Lingard, Bowman, and other hype over the last decade only for it not to produce on Saturdays.
DL since Champ? Yes. Pass rush might be better, if not, I think it's an indictment from the top down. 3 years of recruiting classes and transfers needs to show.
DB? Again, year 3, indictment top down if not excellent this year with all that experience.
WR since Spurrier era? I'd take a step back. I'm not sure right now we match Jefferson, Swain, Grimes, Toney, Hammond, Cleveland, and Copeland (based on then potential like much of what we have currently) in 2018. I would really have to be crazy to say at this point it tops Percy, Baker, and Caldwell in '06 or the '08 guys.

With that said, I do take the same stance that Napier has done a lot more good off the field for things like housing, parking, recruiting (though still not where it must be), etc. than many will credit.

That said, this year is put up or shut up. 0 and I mean 0 excuses not to be 6-1 at worst heading into Jacksonville if he is the coach people have been hyping. I've said it before, will say it again, Miami is bad, Samford should be fireable if a loss, aTm lost a lot from that '22 class and first SEC game on the road for Elko, MSU 3rd staff in 3 years, UCF should never win in the Swamp (especially after a bye), and being 0-3 against Kentucky would be objectively failure.

Then you have to get at least 1 of LSU or FSU with the major rebuilds both programs are undertaking this season. And you can't be blown out a single time. I really don't thing that is asking a lot from a team with a 6th year QB, returning and adding a ton of "snaps" as Nape has used as a catchphrase for 2 off-seasons, and for a team with 7 home games.
You’re probably right with QB. I would say that the room is as good. But you might be right. But you’re talking about only that window of QB. We’ve had over 10 years of less talented depth.

As for running back, I’m talking, particularly about depth. Not about the top end. So, yes to your point, the top two running backs of those years are probably better than our top two running backs right now. I just think that the running back room is the deepest we’ve had in a really long time.

But I think you misunderstood what I was saying about receiver. You are right. The receiver groups over the years have been way deeper than the one we have. I am particularly talking about the talent of EWIII. I think he’s the best receiver we’ve had since a Spurrier coached team. We have a huge issue with depth which is why we have to go out to the portal to get a receiver. I mean there’s EWIII and then who else? Maybe Mizell? If teams double EWIII who is catching the ball? It looked like our third best receiver was the walk on Spierto.

So in conclusion (IMO)

Better than predecessors: QB depth, #1 WR, running back depth, defensive line depth, and linebacker depth.

Worse than predecessors: Pass Rush, wide receiver depth, DB depth and talent, OL talent.
 

GatorFL

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,700
2,899
I think we have a significantly better nutrition and training program than we had under Mullen.
You lost me here. Last year's S&C was a disaster under Hocke. So much so he was demoted and Sling Billy had to bring in a couple guys. Savage was way better. It remains to be seen if Tyler Miles is gonna have them ready.
 

GatorTruth133

Alethea
Lifetime Member
Oct 5, 2017
2,332
6,333
You’re probably right with QB. I would say that the room is as good. But you might be right. But you’re talking about only that window of QB. We’ve had over 10 years of less talented depth.

As for running back, I’m talking, particularly about depth. Not about the top end. So, yes to your point, the top two running backs of those years are probably better than our top two running backs right now. I just think that the running back room is the deepest we’ve had in a really long time.

But I think you misunderstood what I was saying about receiver. You are right. The receiver groups over the years have been way deeper than the one we have. I am particularly talking about the talent of EWIII. I think he’s the best receiver we’ve had since a Spurrier coached team. We have a huge issue with depth which is why we have to go out to the portal to get a receiver. I mean there’s EWIII and then who else? Maybe Mizell? If teams double EWIII who is catching the ball? It looked like our third best receiver was the walk on Spierto.

So in conclusion (IMO)

Better than predecessors: QB depth, #1 WR, running back depth, defensive line depth, and linebacker depth.

Worse than predecessors: Pass Rush, wide receiver depth, DB depth and talent, OL talent.

RB, I have to see it. We had 2 RB's that are/were in the NFL with Davis/Pierce in 2021 plus two 5 star back ups Lingard/Bowman and a high recruit in Wright who was solid in 2021 (4.4 ypc on 76 carries). That is on paper depth. We do not even have that depth on paper now. We have guys like Baugh who looked great in the spring game, but we have to see it before I flag this room as actually deep and not just on paper.

Maybe EWIII is better than over 20 years worth of receivers, but it will take more than one season to get me to say he's better than guys like Harvin, Baker, Caldwell, Robinson, etc. He could be on the way, my point is I have to see it. And the Spierto talk is at least in part an overreaction to the Spring Game. Like Keeter two years ago or Zanders (different position, but the point of Spring heroes). If we recruited like we have been told and Billy G is the best WR coach ever, as many said after the rehire, then this year we should see Wilson, Dike, Jean, Burke, Mizell, etc. performing. Most receivers shouldn't need multiple years to be able to contribute in a good offense.

QB depth, I again will agree to disagree as I think at least having a 3 deep of Trask (way ahead of Mertz), a somewhat experienced back up, if lackluster, in EJ, and an inexperienced, talented but raw, just like DJ though DJ might be a little more along (though practice reports and guys like James from GNFBP) say that DJ is inconsistent as well and Spring was a good day. IDK, just sitting there. I don't think I'd say we are as comfortable going 3 deep now as I would then.

I'd love to here the commentary based on production and not projection. I think that's our divide here. I go with the on paper then and now and you're going on the how it turned out then and projection for top production now.
 

Durty South Swamp

Founding Member
doodley doodley doo!
Lifetime Member
Jun 19, 2014
21,700
48,772
Founding Member
I get it. We definitely haven’t seen any results on the field. And I’m not trying to convince you. I think the program is almost a 180° from Mullen. In both ways. 180° on the field. And 180° off the field.

But I do 100% agree that none of it matters if we don’t win on the field.
i hear ya. i just get sick of all the "culture" nonsense. if the culture isnt a winning one, then its a losing one. if nape wants to pat them on the bottom and read them a bedtime story he can apply for a position at the local daycare. that aint culture. it's pussification. i didnt think it could be worse than mac and his half time naps and pb&j's. at least that retard won more than he lost.
 

GatorJ

Founding Member
Hopeful
Moderator
Jun 11, 2014
21,199
34,112
Founding Member
RB, I have to see it. We had 2 RB's that are/were in the NFL with Davis/Pierce in 2021 plus two 5 star back ups Lingard/Bowman and a high recruit in Wright who was solid in 2021 (4.4 ypc on 76 carries). That is on paper depth. We do not even have that depth on paper now. We have guys like Baugh who looked great in the spring game, but we have to see it before I flag this room as actually deep and not just on paper.

Maybe EWIII is better than over 20 years worth of receivers, but it will take more than one season to get me to say he's better than guys like Harvin, Baker, Caldwell, Robinson, etc. He could be on the way, my point is I have to see it. And the Spierto talk is at least in part an overreaction to the Spring Game. Like Keeter two years ago or Zanders (different position, but the point of Spring heroes). If we recruited like we have been told and Billy G is the best WR coach ever, as many said after the rehire, then this year we should see Wilson, Dike, Jean, Burke, Mizell, etc. performing. Most receivers shouldn't need multiple years to be able to contribute in a good offense.

QB depth, I again will agree to disagree as I think at least having a 3 deep of Trask (way ahead of Mertz), a somewhat experienced back up, if lackluster, in EJ, and an inexperienced, talented but raw, just like DJ though DJ might be a little more along (though practice reports and guys like James from GNFBP) say that DJ is inconsistent as well and Spring was a good day. IDK, just sitting there. I don't think I'd say we are as comfortable going 3 deep now as I would then.

I'd love to here the commentary based on production and not projection. I think that's our divide here. I go with the on paper then and now and you're going on the how it turned out then and projection for top production now.
My comment about Spierto was actually an indictment on the wide receiver depth. Your walk on receiver playing with your back up QB cannot be better than your starting wide receivers. When they’re pumping up Jackson, Dike, and Burke you know we’re fooked.

But there aren’t really gonna be any production numbers. We just had a bunch of young guys play last year. I think we only had like 4 seniors on the whole team in the 3 deep. One on defense and three on offense.

Probably almost half this team was freshman and redshirt freshman.
 

Silverback Gator

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
Aug 1, 2018
2,975
3,045
My comment about Spierto was actually an indictment on the wide receiver depth. Your walk on receiver playing with your back up QB cannot be better than your starting wide receivers. When they’re pumping up Jackson, Dike, and Burke you know we’re fooked.

But there aren’t really gonna be any production numbers. We just had a bunch of young guys play last year. I think we only had like 4 seniors on the whole team in the 3 deep. One on defense and three on offense.

Probably almost half this team was freshman and redshirt freshman.
Spurrier had a number of successful college WRs, mostly(?) because his routes helped them find an opening, no? Nonetheless, it's up to the staff to make their passing offense work with the players they picked.
 

t-gator

Founding Member
too sexy for my shirt
Lifetime Member
Jun 13, 2014
15,765
18,244
Founding Member
I don’t think he’s done a bad job with construction of the program. There was a lot of cleaning up to do after Mullen’s lazy azz left.

But Mullen and Napier are exact opposites. Mullen excelled only on the field and was lazy off the field which led to the foundation crumbling. And Napier excels off the field and sucks on the field.
I wouldn't necessarily say he excels off the field. The staff he put together is ass for the most part
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Help Users

You haven't joined any rooms.

    Birthdays

    Staff online

    Forum statistics

    Threads
    31,760
    Messages
    1,630,598
    Members
    1,644
    Latest member
    TheFoodGator