State of Florida Football

Pablos Tunnel

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UCF is in for a rude awakening when they start playing big boy football nearly every week. Even without UT and OK on the schedule; UCF 10 win seasons are not happening again once they’re in the P5 conference.
Wishful thinking
 

NOLAGATOR

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Im with you on this. Also, geography is in their favor and their fan base is out pacing every other school. Look at the demographics of the students and thier families.

This...
but many are in denial. If UCF's UAA decide this is what they want...and spend the $$$...what will stop them? And now with NIL...Orlando is an awesome media market.
 

Brooks

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Jul 1, 2021
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Ucf will never overtake UF, Fsu or Miami when it comes to getting talent. They will get housed a few times a year when they join the big 12. They will always be there getting the leftovers and rejected players that those programs don't want. Anybody in here claiming ucf will somehow be the #2 program in the state at some point is just a silly argument. I would like it better if they joined the ACC so miami and fsu could smack them down every year.
 

Yankeetown

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Ucf will never overtake UF, Fsu or Miami when it comes to getting talent. They will get housed a few times a year when they join the big 12. They will always be there getting the leftovers and rejected players that those programs don't want. Anybody in here claiming ucf will somehow be the #2 program in the state at some point is just a silly argument. I would like it better if they joined the ACC so miami and fsu could smack them down every year.

Forecasting the future by refusing to consider how circumstances and motivations could change is a really bad technique.

So let's put it this way ... consider:
* UCF's position slab dab in the middle of the nation's best state for recruiting (arguably),
* its size in terms of students as one of the largest universities in the country,
* its financial footprint,
* its location in a major media hub,
* its potential leverage in the legislature due to the local demographics, and
* its ability to avoid annual face-to-face conference games with the top in-state rivals

and explain to the skeptics why UCF (in your opinion) * ABSOLUTELY CANNOT* do what the much less well-situated Clemson from South Carolina has done to pull itself up by its bootstraps .... played in 4 national championships in the past 8 years, and won 2.

Now I don't think UCF will come close to pulling off a Clemson, but saying they couldn't is just being really close-minded. Especially when UF + FSU + Miami are all in concurrent low-points, the likes of which haven't been seen in 40 years.
 

Theologator

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Ucf will never overtake UF, Fsu or Miami when it comes to getting talent. They will get housed a few times a year when they join the big 12. They will always be there getting the leftovers and rejected players that those programs don't want. Anybody in here claiming ucf will somehow be the #2 program in the state at some point is just a silly argument. I would like it better if they joined the ACC so miami and fsu could smack them down every year.

UCF would have smacked F$U and scUM down at least 3, maybe 4, of the last 5 years. scUM is barely a .500 ACC team with atrocious fan support.
 

Gator By Marriage

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Forecasting the future by refusing to consider how circumstances and motivations could change is a really bad technique.

So let's put it this way ... consider:
* UCF's position slab dab in the middle of the nation's best state for recruiting (arguably),
* its size in terms of students as one of the largest universities in the country,
* its financial footprint,
* its location in a major media hub,
* its potential leverage in the legislature due to the local demographics, and
* its ability to avoid annual face-to-face conference games with the top in-state rivals

and explain to the skeptics why UCF (in your opinion) * ABSOLUTELY CANNOT* do what the much less well-situated Clemson from South Carolina has done to pull itself up by its bootstraps .... played in 4 national championships in the past 8 years, and won 2.

Now I don't think UCF will come close to pulling off a Clemson, but saying they couldn't is just being really close-minded. Especially when UF + FSU + Miami are all in concurrent low-points, the likes of which haven't been seen in 40 years.
Assuming you are right, the questions for me are
1) How much money is UCF willing to throw at the program and
2) Can they find the right HC to get them to that level? I just don’t see Malzahn being that guy.
 

Pablos Tunnel

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Assuming you are right, the questions for me are
1) How much money is UCF willing to throw at the program and
2) Can they find the right HC to get them to that level? I just don’t see Malzahn being that guy.
Money will not be an issue. Plus they are not hog tied by trying to be elite. If the alums want it they will go for it.
Plenty of resources:
Football loving culture
Massive growing alumni base
Tons of available land to grow
Students are mid level and mostly from Florida high schools
Growing political clout
Ect ect
 

CU-UF

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Forecasting the future by refusing to consider how circumstances and motivations could change is a really bad technique.

Now these are your points on why you think UCF is going to become a force in college football
* UCF's position slab dab in the middle of the nation's best state for recruiting (arguably) - This I agree with, but my counter would be its also the most competitive state for recruiting. Do you think UCF is suddenly going to prevent all the programs from getting the talent. You mention current circumstances. When was the last time UCF pulled a top 5 class in the country? Even this year, with what you say is historical lows among the big 3 the best they did is 41 FSU did better and UF and UM at 49 and the only reason why they did better than them is because of numbers signed. Their average composite was an 87 versus 90 - UF and 92 - UM. That is current circumstance.
* its size in terms of students as one of the largest universities in the country, - I don't know why people keep bringing this up as if it is some type of ultimate power. As I said before, the majority of their student body is derived from online distance education. You might as well compare them to the University of Phoenix. They don't continuously pack their stadium. And since when has student body size been the predictor of any football success. Some of the most successful programs have pretty moderate student body size.
* its financial footprint, - Its financial footprint is dependent upon its conference affiliation. Everyone knows that. Again, current circumstances, they are not even in a P5 conference. They WILL be moving to one that is losing its two premier programs in a couple of years, which also coincides when the 2025 television contracts are up. Now do you think the Big 12 is going to end up with the best TV contract? Their financial footprint will improve, but by how much is a huge question
* its location in a major media hub, - This is something Orlando people tell themselves and like to tell everyone, but first Orlando is not a major media hub and second, like student body, this has little to no impact on athletic success.
* its potential leverage in the legislature due to the local demographics, and - Either you do not live in the state of Florida or you are blind to the legislative process. Local demographics do not drive the legislature, the board of governors drive it, which are appointed political positions. If anything, UCF is under probation from the Legislature for misappropriating funds that the legislature allocated. That cost them their president and they are still digging out of that hole.
* its ability to avoid annual face-to-face conference games with the top in-state rivals. - This I agree with.

and explain to the skeptics why UCF (in your opinion) * ABSOLUTELY CANNOT* do what the much less well-situated Clemson from South Carolina has done to pull itself up by its bootstraps .... played in 4 national championships in the past 8 years, and won 2. Finally, Clemson had already won a title back around 1980 and spent the 20+ years after that in a major P5 conference and all the benefits that accrue to it. I agree, is there a chance that UCF is going to win a title in the next 3 - 5 years and become a force in the state of Florida and college football? Sure. They certainly are going to be in better position than any of the lessor programs in Florida. But history AND current circumstances do not say their chance is better than UF, FSU or UM. Therefore, only a blind pumper would sit there and assert that it's a high probability and legitimate threat to happen. In 20 years? Maybe. In the near future 3,5, even 10 years, probably not.

There, I explained why UCF will not do what you assert is possible. All based on not only current circumstances but also historical fact.


 

Theologator

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Who said they are going to be a force? All I’m saying is they’ll be a mid-level P5 program, which may pull them even with or above a steadily sinking scUM. They cannot catch us or F$U as a program, although they will get the rare win as they just did.

Being in the depleted Big 12 is not going to attract top 250 talent, Ames, Waco & Ok City aren’t hotspots, but they’ll be competitive in that conference and on par with mid-level ACC or Pac12 teams. Look at what they have accomplished where they are.

It’s debatable whether the P5 will exist or be more like the P3+2 or P2+3. But the Big Least wasn’t much either.
 

NOLAGATOR

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Not for any other reason but location. I would rather play UCF or USF every year. Im tired of FSU.

FSU is Historical...but I get it.

I'd rather play 2 of the 3 every year. Or 4 if you add USF.

I'd like to see another Division...for all the USF, FAU, FIU, ULL, Tulane etc.

Have D-1 (Power 5 or 6), D2, D3, D4

Get rid of Bowls...use them for D-1 and D-2 Championships and Play-offs.
 
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Pablos Tunnel

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FSU is Historical...but I get it.

I'd rather play 2 of the 3 every year. Or 4 if you add USF.

I'd like to see another Division...for all the USF, FAU, FIU, ULL, Tulane etc.

Have D-1 (Power 5 or 6), D2, D3, D4

Get rid of Bowls...use them for D-1 and D-2 Championships and Play-offs.

yep
the bowls have become useless and boring
 

Pablos Tunnel

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Now these are your points on why you think UCF is going to become a force in college football
* UCF's position slab dab in the middle of the nation's best state for recruiting (arguably) - This I agree with, but my counter would be its also the most competitive state for recruiting. Do you think UCF is suddenly going to prevent all the programs from getting the talent. You mention current circumstances. When was the last time UCF pulled a top 5 class in the country? Even this year, with what you say is historical lows among the big 3 the best they did is 41 FSU did better and UF and UM at 49 and the only reason why they did better than them is because of numbers signed. Their average composite was an 87 versus 90 - UF and 92 - UM. That is current circumstance.
* its size in terms of students as one of the largest universities in the country, - I don't know why people keep bringing this up as if it is some type of ultimate power. As I said before, the majority of their student body is derived from online distance education. You might as well compare them to the University of Phoenix. They don't continuously pack their stadium. And since when has student body size been the predictor of any football success. Some of the most successful programs have pretty moderate student body size.
* its financial footprint, - Its financial footprint is dependent upon its conference affiliation. Everyone knows that. Again, current circumstances, they are not even in a P5 conference. They WILL be moving to one that is losing its two premier programs in a couple of years, which also coincides when the 2025 television contracts are up. Now do you think the Big 12 is going to end up with the best TV contract? Their financial footprint will improve, but by how much is a huge question
* its location in a major media hub, - This is something Orlando people tell themselves and like to tell everyone, but first Orlando is not a major media hub and second, like student body, this has little to no impact on athletic success.
* its potential leverage in the legislature due to the local demographics, and - Either you do not live in the state of Florida or you are blind to the legislative process. Local demographics do not drive the legislature, the board of governors drive it, which are appointed political positions. If anything, UCF is under probation from the Legislature for misappropriating funds that the legislature allocated. That cost them their president and they are still digging out of that hole.
* its ability to avoid annual face-to-face conference games with the top in-state rivals. - This I agree with.

and explain to the skeptics why UCF (in your opinion) * ABSOLUTELY CANNOT* do what the much less well-situated Clemson from South Carolina has done to pull itself up by its bootstraps .... played in 4 national championships in the past 8 years, and won 2. Finally, Clemson had already won a title back around 1980 and spent the 20+ years after that in a major P5 conference and all the benefits that accrue to it. I agree, is there a chance that UCF is going to win a title in the next 3 - 5 years and become a force in the state of Florida and college football? Sure. They certainly are going to be in better position than any of the lessor programs in Florida. But history AND current circumstances do not say their chance is better than UF, FSU or UM. Therefore, only a blind pumper would sit there and assert that it's a high probability and legitimate threat to happen. In 20 years? Maybe. In the near future 3,5, even 10 years, probably not.

There, I explained why UCF will not do what you assert is possible. All based on not only current circumstances but also historical fact.

Great points but I believe the assertion was that UCF will overtake the likes of FSU and UM. Winning a Natty wasn’t mentioned. Am I missing something.
 

Theologator

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I don’t run into scUM fans much but I’m going to start telling them UCF has passed them. Just for the sport of it. The indignant explosion will be beautiful to behold. “But they have been ranked twice as often as you the last 10 years…You haven’t been top 10 since 2003…Never should have fired Coker…” Such fun.
 

lagator

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I mean, technically, they will be.
Even if the conference level is just a glorified G5 type talent.

:dunno:
Wouldn't this argument be more convincing if Baylor didn't just win the Big12 and Sugar Bowl (not to mention just win a NC in roundball) and Ok St weren't most likely 1 play away from making the Playoff in place of Cincy, and just won the Fiesta Bowl? No doubt, the league took a hit when TX and OK left, but lets face it, the quality of FB in the league probably actually increased with the loss of perennial loser TX. So we are really talking about losing a consistent top 5 team in OK which is a big deal, but for the current time anyway they still have their top 2 finishers, and it will be easier to win the league and get in the expanded playoffs with OK gone.

It's the TV dollars that took a major hit with the losses, especially TX, but I don't think it's the deathknell folks are making it out to be.
usa_today_17289979.0.jpg
 
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