What is the reason for Mullen's perceived cap?

neteng

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Assuming you mean 'Natty'. I would suggest that you have to have sub-championships along with the Natty (Div, Conf). I also assume just because you have a Natty does not make you Elite. Agreed? Otherwise we are letting the Gene Chiziks into the club.
 

TheDouglas78

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Assuming you mean 'Natty'. I would suggest that you have to have sub-championships along with the Natty (Div, Conf). I also assume just because you have a Natty does not make you Elite. Agreed? Otherwise we are letting the Gene Chiziks into the club.

One National Championship can be due to luck or timing, multiple or being in the game multiples or regular basis. One championship coaches like Chizik or Coker who got by on the previous regimes recruiting and with a lucky season are not elite.
 

neteng

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So we got Saban. That is a given.

Are there any other coaches currently coaching that are 'elite'? Is it 'how' they do it that matters as well or just Natty's in the pocket?
 

TheDouglas78

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So we got Saban. That is a given.

Are there any other coaches currently coaching that are 'elite'? Is it 'how' they do it that matters as well or just Natty's in the pocket?

Meyer would be elite, 3 National Titles two programs, though I'm not a fan assuming Dabo,
 

neteng

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To be honest, I aint a fan of saying Meyer is elite ... yet. He looks like he is ready to pack up and move out again. He gets it going ... then can't keep it going. But for the sake of not arguing, okay ... Saban and Meyer a distant 2nd?

Dabo ... yeah, I'd give him the nod at this point. He has a process rolling.
 

Sec14Gator

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To the original post, I was, and still am in the concerned he has a cap group, but not because of the records of Jackie Sherril, SOS, or Sly Croom applied in a transitive way to Mullen. Context and circumstances matter. Overall though, it seems this thread is a lot more absolutism from the pumpers that Mullen is definitively the guy versus the "dumpers" who (even Dougie) seem to be saying let's wait and see.

My concern is his UF history and hiring history impacting two aspects to winning a championship (1) recruiting and (2) offensive style. Regarding the first, under Meyer there were a bunch of guys known to be great recruiters, with Strong and Doc coming to mind immediately. Mullen was thought of as a good coach but mediocre recruiter. Then at MSU and now here, he hasn't yet demonstrated that reputation to be false and hasn't hired a staff that is clearly overcoming his personal limits. May he? Hope so, but it was part of the concern and little has changed yet. It still could, but we will see much more than we know.

Then, absent recruiting being a dominating force, ala the Meyer years, the offense must rely upon multiple long sustained drives. That style requires execution over and over and over again. There is a reason Mullen keeps harping on "consistency in everything we do." Any errors completely derail a drive and, potentially, the gameplan because you end up with less possessions to score and can't adjust to things like a pick six or kick return. There is just little room for error over the course of a game with that style and it doesn't put great fear in anyone unless you dominate recruiting (see above). I believe a better comparison to Mullen's performance at MSU is Briles at Baylor. They had an offense that could run, short pass, etc. (so could Spurrier), but also blow you up frequently. As a result, that bottom feeder school won a lot of games no one expected and battled for a playoff spot in perhaps the most stunning turnaround of any program (maybe Kan. St compares). Then, his continued reliance upon the same assistants for so many years shows a reticence to adapt much.

I hope I'm wrong, as Mullen has outlier years that suggest he can reach some heights (Utah, Harvin/Tebow and Dak). Plus, unlike recruiting, the offense is already improving and he is taking more chances than I expected, both down the field, fourth down, and in special teams. But a loss to UK and UGA, combined with 1 score wins at home against LSU (remember Mac and Chump), and against a middling MSU don't tell us anything definitive yet. The improvement we see, however, is a sign that we can be hopeful though. That is why it seems we are all enjoying this season more. Last year was hopeless, this year we can debate the scope of our future improvement.
 

divits

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Here is my thought and I truly hope he proves me wrong. Is he the coach we need right now. The obvious answer is yes. He knows what he is doing, gets the most out of the trash he inherited, and actually wants to be here. Will he ever take us back to consistently being in the championship hunts? I'm not sure about that, but I hope he proves me wrong. I can't hate a coach that really wants to be here at this point in time after the last 8 years. If I had to give a ceilings based on what we know now I would compare him to Mark Richt. A guy that consistently wins, recruits well enough, but never takes you all the way. That's not a bad thing for the next couple of years after Butters tried to murder our program. I truly hope he proves us all wrong and becomes a coach that is always in the hunt, but if he stabilizes the program that is a giant upgrade right now. My question is that if he does prove to be a Richt like coach, how many 8-11 wins seasons in a row does he get before we are tired of it. I think the biggest goal in mind should be that if he is not the guy, at least he sets the table for the next one.
Mark Richt's problem has ALWAYS been that he is predictable and conservative. Most times I know what his plan is and what he'll do. Mullen is a much better play caller and game planner. If he can recruit as well as Richt or Smart he can win it all.
 

Swamp Donkey

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The issues are pretty clear. We need a QB who is capable of running this offense and some DBs who know how to play the position. If we get those pieces and some more quality depth at all positions we have the kind of coach who can help us compete with anyone.
We need ALOT more than that and it obviously isnt Mullinz fault.

We need DEs who arent destroyed every running play. We need heavy DTs who demand two blockers to keep the LBs clean.

We need linebackers who can stop the run and cover, or even one of the two things.

We need safeties who know to wrap on hits and who can stay at least innthe same tv frame as the guy they are covering.

We need OL. Ten of them.

But yes, we need a QB and some healthy CBs and a competent backup or three.
 

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We need ALOT more than that and it obviously isnt Mullinz fault.

We need DEs who arent destroyed every running play. We need heavy DTs who demand two blockers to keep the LBs clean.

We need linebackers who can stop the run and cover, or even one of the two things.

We need safeties who know to wrap on hits and who can stay at least innthe same tv frame as the guy they are covering.

We need OL. Ten of them.

But yes, we need a QB and some healthy CBs and a competent backup or three.

We need depth.

You know, this is year 1?
 

TheDouglas78

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Mark Richt's problem has ALWAYS been that he is predictable and conservative. Most times I know what his plan is and what he'll do. Mullen is a much better play caller and game planner. If he can recruit as well as Richt or Smart he can win it all.

Richt's conservative style in big games, unfortunately right now that is what we have to do with Franks. But is also what Mullens did at MSU in big games. I'm hoping that was due to talent, not personality.
 

divits

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We need ALOT more than that and it obviously isnt Mullinz fault.

We need DEs who arent destroyed every running play. We need heavy DTs who demand two blockers to keep the LBs clean.

We need linebackers who can stop the run and cover, or even one of the two things.

We need safeties who know to wrap on hits and who can stay at least innthe same tv frame as the guy they are covering.

We need OL. Ten of them.

But yes, we need a QB and some healthy CBs and a competent backup or three.
We currently be undefeated if we had just a good quarterback and some decent DBs.
 

Swamp Donkey

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We currently be undefeated if we had just a good quarterback and some decent DBs.
And we'd get boatraced by Bammer, Crackumbus or Clempson.

But it was our run defense and OL not QB or CBs that screwed up the Kintucky game.
 

TheDouglas78

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Not to those who want to be "right" about the hire.

Tom we are in year one, there is no right or wrong about this hire yet... That's the problem so many are down on their knees praying to the alter, instead of stepping back and saying... it's year 1, there is at least 3 years until Mullen has gotten it to be his program. A lot of people were saying the same type of things including making excuses in 2015. Why can't we pump the brakes to see what we actually have.

We are all Gators wanting what is best for the program, and it seems the pumpers want to dismiss the concerns that are still valid on this hire. In 2020 is when we will truly know what we have.
 

NOLAGATOR

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3-1 Mississippi State was ranked at the time, I think they should only count post season rankings.

So a team beats you early in the season and then loses their QB. You now say they were no good when they played you?

Or a team has little depth and is playing walk-ons at the end of the year? They don't count?

No wonder you struggle .
 

TheDouglas78

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So a team beats you early in the season and then loses their QB. You now say they were no good when they played you?

Or a team has little depth and is playing walk-ons at the end of the year? They don't count?

No wonder you struggle .

I really have you in an emotional state don't I.... damn you're triggered.
 

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