Do these awful "transition" (i.e. NIT) years warrant criticism for Billy Donovan?

[oxrageous]

I hesitated making this thread, because I can already read the knee-jerk posts in my mind. Here they are in advance:

"With his titles and Final Four's, I think he's entitled to a down year!"

"Classic spoiled Gator fan, complaining about the best coach in program history!"

"No wonder guys like Spurrier left early, our "fans" can't help but always complain!"

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Now that I got those out of the way, I would hope we could have an adult discussion. I believe we are lucky to have Billy Donovan. I'm not advocating his firing or anything of the sort. However, I don't believe ANY coach, regardless of his resume, is infallible.

Here we are the the point again of having a "transition" (i.e. NIT) year, something we went through for two years following the 04's mass exodus. What this appears to come down to is recruiting. Is there anything Donovan could have done to see to it that we have some overlap in these classes? Why does it always seem like our entire starting lineup leaves at once? I just rarely see the other elite basketball schools having this problem of being great, and then freaking awful the next season.

I don't follow basketball recruiting very closely, so those that do I'd like to hear from. Do you believe there's anything Donovan could have done differently over the course of his career to prevent these throwaway seasons? Why are we in the position of having a walk-on on the floor at the end of games? Should that ever happen to a Billy Donovan club?

Discuss.

 

[MidwestChomp]

Why are we in the position of having a walk-on on the floor at the end of games?

I think it's all about the Walkers. Chris is still having trouble and Devon busting his ACL I think is a bigger issue than we thought.

I'm surprised by the poor play this year. The talent is there, but something isn't clicking. From what Billy D has said the difference between this team and the 2 NIT teams after the 04s is that this team works their tails off but guys keep getting injured or sick and that is affecting chemistry. However, these guys (except Horford and frosh) did play with each other last year so the chemistry issues are puzzling as well.

 

[Captain Sasquatch]

College basketball is as fluid as any sport today. With a small roster size and so many kids that leave early for the NBA and/or transferring, it's tough to keep continuity. It's even worse if a recruit doesn't pan out immediately or doesn't qualify academically (Walker and Francis). Every coach is going to have a bad season every now and then, especially in today's CBB world. The fact that he won back to back championships and then took a team with exactly one NBA player over four years to the Elite 8 or better in four straight seasons says a hell of a lot more than having a down year this year because of graduation/injuries/eligibility issues.

 

[rogdochar]

Recruiting is our weak point. Really, there's that 7'6" kid 1 hour's drive from Gainesville whose main Life-Focus is to
get a biochemistry degree and UCF got him. On Biochemistry alone he should have picked UF. I've seen comments
on here of Donovan's dislike of recruiting. We do not get a dominant "big man".

I regret that we so often have a team of 4 seniors getting (deserving) all the essential PT; then the next year we're
high school. It's puzzle- some compared to the standard programs - a direction we should be well on our way towards.

 

[t-gator]

The biggest problem is Kentucky is pulling in so many McDonald's all Americans there's a smaller pool to choose from and the two all Americans we did get kasey hill and Chris walker aren't as good as expected. There's also been some bad luck with injuries and eligibility issues. I think the year we signed Michael Frazier, Devon walker and Dillon Graham hurt us because we didn't sign a big man and the only player out of that class was Michael Frazier. I guess I'd say recruiting or recruiting errors during those good runs didn't set us up for the future maybe?

 

[GatorTAG]

Muschamp recruited 50 DBs every year and Donovan recruits 10 guards every year. When he finally got a McDonald's AA big man (Walker) he turns out to be a dud.

 

[Swamped Gator]

So let's look at the "bad" transition years. It was immediately after the 04's left, which is arguably one of the best basketball teams of all time. Back to back championships is a phenomenal feat. ANY program would have a huge drop off with all of that talent leaving.

Now let's look at the senior class from last year. We lost a core of consistent deep run tourney players with tons of experience, talent, and leadership. Billy gets a pass in my opinion. What he's done for this program at a football school is incredible.

 

[oxrageous]

So let's look at the "bad" transition years. It was immediately after the 04's left, which is arguably one of the best basketball teams of all time. Back to back championships is a phenomenal feat. ANY program would have a huge drop off with all of that talent leaving.

Now let's look at the senior class from last year. We lost a core of consistent deep run tourney players with tons of experience, talent, and leadership. Billy gets a pass in my opinion. What he's done for this program at a football school is incredible.

I knew it was only a matter of time.

What you just typed has nothing to do with the premise of the thread. We never seem to have any quality overlap in recruiting classes. There's also a difference between a "drop off" and a dumpster fire. I've heard multiple times that Donovan "is the best coach in the nation" and yet here we are again headed for the NIT for the 3rd time in 8 years.

Perhaps the biggest problem is simply that we're Florida. The elite blue-chippers would rather go to Kentucky, UNC, Kansas, etc. There really isn't much Donovan can do about that.

 

[LagoonGator68]

This team is long on talent, but has no guts......yet.

 

[MidwestChomp]

I think you are correct Ox. The elite players want to hit up the schools with tradition. Also, Billy D does not like the one and done players, and would rather build a program. What happens to Calipari if 7-8 of this guys leave for the NBA after this year. Are they NIT bound like they were after they won it? Yes, I know you'll say he will just reload, which is a fair argument.

However, I still don't know how he can't pull quality big guys every year. All he needs to do is point at the bigs he put in the NBA. Is that not enough?

 

[t-gator]

I think Billy recruits on par with everyone but duke and Kentucky. Kasey hill,Chris walker and Devin Robinson were all supposed to be one and done caliber players but for some reason they're not. Every school has a down year, look at Kentucky they lost to Robert Morris in the first round of the nit, duke and Kansas lose in the first round every other year it seems like. North Carolina has had a couple nit years. Every basketball powerhouse has it's struggles. I wouldn't call it a dumpster fire, we've been competitive in all our losses. There's been some very lucky shots go down to beat us.

 

[soflagator]

It's New Year's Eve, a paid school holiday, and you're gonna throw this out there??

StephenPE is probably a 7-8 Johnnie Walker's deep. Could get ugly.

 

[VulcanAlex]

While I am not an expert I think that UF attracts players who need development and not those who want to be one and done. That means that we get a group, prune it a little and then have a good team. Then we repeat. I don't know but I see some open drives to the basket where the defense is all on one side and a guard has only one person to beat. I generally yell "drive" thinking a foul is the worst that will happen. I can't remember even one drive. Ball screening seems to be ineffective I don't see too many open threes, drives inside, or open big men off the screen. Motivation and playing together are on coach and the players so some criticism is appropriate. I bet coach would agree.

 

[JohnCoctostan]

I think it's a combination of graduation and injuries. With the mash unit he has had to deal with this year, he has done a good job.

He has a bit of an unbalanced roster, which falls on him. However, regardless of what you say, you can not ignore his consistent success the last four years. This season is not in a vacuum. To single this year out and criticize him is short sighted. We will be back. Even Coach K had had some down years. It happens.

 

[t-gator]

I disagree whole heartily with anyone that says Billy doesn't recruit one and dones. That's completely laughable. I can promise you every one of those guys has an offer from Billy. Do you guys think Billy would have taken Scottie wilbekein over John wall a few years ago? Trust me,he'd love to have a roster full of lottery picks like Kentucky ,that notion is silly.

 

[GatorJ]

There's been an issue with depth and injuries this year. But not anymore. This team just takes a lot of threes. The only person who consistently drives to the basket is Hill. And he's probably the smallest guy on the court. We had like what? 10 free throws last night? Are you kidding?

And some of that is coaching. So criticism is warranted. And he would tell you the same. But the team will figure it out. It always does.

 

[TheDouglas78]

There's been an issue with depth and injuries this year. But not anymore. This team just takes a lot of threes. The only person who consistently drives to the basket is Hill. And he's probably the smallest guy on the court. We had like what? 10 free throws last night? Are you kidding?

And some of that is coaching. So criticism is warranted. And he would tell you the same. But the team will figure it out. It always does.

Exactly it is early with a new unit. It's going to take some time for this years group to get it together.

 

[heversle]

I don't know if Billy is completely to blame here, but I do see Ox's point. A lot of things have happened that set the team back (Brandone Francis - who would've contributed a lot this year- being ineligible and Eli Carter seemingly being made of glass immediately come to mind). Also, this team doesn't really have an identity. The post game is non-existent and we're not shooting the ball with any consistency. I feel like part of our shooting woes come from how indecisive we are on offense; we don't ever seem to be in a rhythm.

There are too many occasions in which one of our players have been wide open from behind the ark, only to make an unnecessary extra pass and/or dribble into traffic and force up a bad shot. Devin Robinson is a key culprit when it comes to this. This team can be unselfish to a detriment at times. Who is the guy that we give the ball to in crunch time to make a play and win the game for us? Nobody WANTS to take the big shots at the end of games. Right now, this bunch is just a team of role players. Part of this is Billy's fault for not recruiting more elite talent, but the blame also lies with the upperclassmen for not stepping up to the plate.

That being said, I think a lot of the unselfish play has to do with Billy's system. A lot of the elite ball-dominant, playmaking guard and forward prospects from around the country watch our games and they see that Billy's teams are largely predicated on ball movement and stout defense. While this has worked really well for his teams and he's been extremely successful playing this brand of basketball, it may not be the most exciting in terms of luring those one and done kids.

 

[LagoonGator68]

I don't follow basketball recruiting very closely, so those that do I'd like to hear from. Do you believe there's anything Donovan could have done differently over the course of his career to prevent these throwaway seasons? Why are we in the position of having a walk-on on the floor at the end of games? Should that ever happen to a Billy Donovan club?

This is not a throwaway season. Kurtz has EARNED his pt. It happens to every coach, except John Wooden for 8 years. Billy prefers that his players "discover" a refuse to lose mentality for themselves and it takes longer for some teams than others. This team may not learn it this year.

 

[oxrageous]

This is not a throwaway season. Kurtz has EARNED his pt. It happens to every coach, except John Wooden for 8 years. Billy prefers that his players "discover" a refuse to lose mentality for themselves and it takes longer for some teams than others. This team may not learn it this year.

Some would say if a walk-on earns that much playing time then the coach could have done a better job recruiting.