Briles coming back to Baylor?

[CU-UF]

Did you even look at the findings of fact that was commissioned by Baylor for an independent 3rd party to investigate? report. Just some highlights from the summary:

"Pepper also found examples of actions by University administrators that directly discouraged complainants from reporting or participating in student conduct processes, or that contributed to or accommodated a hostile environment. In one instance, those actions constituted retaliation against a complainant for reporting sexual assault."

"In addition to broader University failings, Pepper found specific failings within both the football program and Athletics Department leadership, including a failure to identify and respond to a pattern of sexual violence by a football player, to take action in response to reports of a sexual assault by multiple football players, and to take action in response to a report of dating violence. Pepper’s findings also reflect significant concerns about the tone and culture within Baylor’s football program as it relates to accountability for all forms of athlete misconduct."

 

[NCOGator]

There was talk on the local talk radio here in San Antonio and one of the callers made a very good comment. He said if SMU got the death penalty for paying their players he thought Baylor should to. His reasoning is hell SMU didn't "hurt" anyone but lost control of the program, and Baylor pretty much had Tallassee Police Department running that program, hid allegations, and they really lost intuitional control of the program. I have to say that I agree with him. I am not in favor of the death penalty (in college sports), but if a precedence was set then you have to go with it.

 

[BMF]

From coachingsearch.com:

Baylor: HornsDigest.com reports a push by some donors to reinstate Art Briles has ended, and the school has begun contract settlement talks with Briles. The contract had $40 million guaranteed remaining on it, and the site says the settlement is expected to be around $20 million.

 

[TheDouglas78]

What exactly do you know that Briles did that requires he be fired? I know lots of talk show guys are yelling about how awful it was at Baylor but what specific things do you think Briles did that requires he be fired? After all he is not an at will employee, but rather has a contract.

I know he took the transfer from Boise. Did he know what the kid had been accused of? Did he fail to do due diligence or did Boise muddle the waters possibly due to FERPA? Is there anything else Briles did that might merit firing?

Have you read/heard that reportedly Baylor owes Briles $40 million on his contract? That would take a lot of extra tort liability to make it worth firing him without cause depending on how his contract reads.

It's called loss of institutional control, he will not be the first Head Coach to be caught in that. It's the least of the charges that he could be found with, but each coach that has received that from the NCAA has been fired. Some guys with NC's got that too, is Biles more important than Tressell was to tOSU or Carroll (ran before the hammer came down) at USC?

 

[rogdochar]

I think the NCAA did not realize how long that death-penalty would hurt SMU,
extending far into punishing innocent people. Learning from that, the NCAA will probably
find a maximal penalty short of death.

Baylor employees involved in wrongdoing over rape victimization should be fired.
Probably be an effective future deterrent if there were serious "legal-talk" about putting
some of them on the sexual offender list = (but not really do it).

All in all, what an awful mess attached a beautifully people-engaging sport.

 

[InstiGATOR1]

Did you even look at the findings of fact that was commissioned by Baylor for an independent 3rd party to investigate? report. Just some highlights from the summary:

"Pepper also found examples of actions by University administrators that directly discouraged complainants from reporting or participating in student conduct processes, or that contributed to or accommodated a hostile environment. In one instance, those actions constituted retaliation against a complainant for reporting sexual assault."

"In addition to broader University failings, Pepper found specific failings within both the football program and Athletics Department leadership, including a failure to identify and respond to a pattern of sexual violence by a football player, to take action in response to reports of a sexual assault by multiple football players, and to take action in response to a report of dating violence. Pepper’s findings also reflect significant concerns about the tone and culture within Baylor’s football program as it relates to accountability for all forms of athlete misconduct."

Of course I didn't and neither did you as it was not put on paper or released for liability issues. I did like you see the summaries you quoted from. Among the things I know that apparently you don't independent in this instance means not connected to Baylor. It does not mean unbiased.

The first quotation you have is about Baylor and has nothing to do with the football program unless you think Briles should be fired for the Baylor counseling center telling a rape victim they were too full. It is pretty amazing if that really happened, but again Briles did not run the counseling center.

The second quotation does not mention anything Briles did. So far in this I have seen Baylor's football program criticized for responding to people claiming to be victims and criticized for not responding to people claiming to be victims. That raises a red flag with me. The idea from another post that Baylor might give him $20 million indicates to me he is not being fired for cause, but because someone wants a famous name scalp or a football program scalp. If Briles had done what you guys are assuming he did, I can not believe Baylor would pay him that kind of money IF ANY. Remember Baylor is private school meaning the money they give someone has to be raised it is not just more fax dollars thrown at someone.

 

[InstiGATOR1]

It's called loss of institutional control, he will not be the first Head Coach to be caught in that. It's the least of the charges that he could be found with, but each coach that has received that from the NCAA has been fired. Some guys with NC's got that too, is Biles more important than Tressell was to tOSU or Carroll (ran before the hammer came down) at USC?

No coach is fired tor lack of institutional control. Anyone fired is fired for what they did. Lack of institutional control is a matter for the institution AS THE NAME IMPLIES. GEE.

 

[CU-UF]

Of course I didn't and neither did you as it was not put on paper or released for liability issues. I did like you see the summaries you quoted from. Among the things I know that apparently you don't independent in this instance means not connected to Baylor. It does not mean unbiased.

The first quotation you have is about Baylor and has nothing to do with the football program unless you think Briles should be fired for the Baylor counseling center telling a rape victim they were too full. It is pretty amazing if that really happened, but again Briles did not run the counseling center.

The second quotation does not mention anything Briles did. So far in this I have seen Baylor's football program criticized for responding to people claiming to be victims and criticized for not responding to people claiming to be victims. That raises a red flag with me. The idea from another post that Baylor might give him $20 million indicates to me he is not being fired for cause, but because someone wants a famous name scalp or a football program scalp. If Briles had done what you guys are assuming he did, I can not believe Baylor would pay him that kind of money IF ANY. Remember Baylor is private school meaning the money they give someone has to be raised it is not just more fax dollars thrown at someone.

Ummm Baylor published the report, I put a link in my post so you could edumucate yourself.....

 

[rogdochar]

No coach is fired tor lack of institutional control. Anyone fired is fired for what they did. Lack of institutional control is a matter for the institution AS THE NAME IMPLIES. GEE.

Syllogism = deductive logic presenting 2 statements that irrefutably verify a 3rd conclusion.
1) anyone fired is fired for what they did 2) Briles was fired, ergo = he did a fireable offense.

 

[TheDouglas78]

No coach is fired tor lack of institutional control. Anyone fired is fired for what they did. Lack of institutional control is a matter for the institution AS THE NAME IMPLIES. GEE.

So if the institution is the Football Team, and their is a lack of institutional control, and it's a matter of that institution which is the football team... and the Head Coach is the head of said football team....

Go back to your Briles love "InstiGator", because I think you might be out of your element. If Briles lacked the control over his football team, it's a form of lack of institutional control... Obviously it doesn't stop at Briles, but Briles was a member of the institution, and a lead in the institution that was allowing the transaction to continue to happen and cover up what was happening.

 

[601Gator]

Wasn't Briles accused of meeting with accusers and their families to try to convince them to not press charges? That alone is grounds for firing and probation.

 

[g8tr72]

Art Briles accuses Baylor of wrongful termination
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/art-briles-accuses-baylor-of-wrongful-termination-182900206.html

 

[InstiGATOR1]

Wasn't Briles accused of meeting with accusers and their families to try to convince them to not press charges? That alone is grounds for firing and probation.

Actually in one law suit against Baylor I saw last night Briles was mentioned for failing to call back after the victim and family called his office. See once these things turn political, you can be criticized for whatever you do or don't do.

 

[rogdochar]

Glad Briles is fighting this. The resultant negative publicity will turn off the parents of
upcoming state of Texas' recruits.

I'm on hold right now, with the Provost of Baylor ... by using my forensick skills, I've
uncovered a separate private bank account out of which Briles wrote checks to the
Wacollege Abortion Clinic ??

 

[InstiGATOR1]

So if the institution is the Football Team, and their is a lack of institutional control, and it's a matter of that institution which is the football team... and the Head Coach is the head of said football team....

Go back to your Briles love "InstiGator", because I think you might be out of your element. If Briles lacked the control over his football team, it's a form of lack of institutional control... Obviously it doesn't stop at Briles, but Briles was a member of the institution, and a lead in the institution that was allowing the transaction to continue to happen and cover up what was happening.

Seriously? And you think I am out of my element. The institution in the lack of institutional control is the INSTITUTION OF HIGHER EDUCATION ie the college or university. It is not the athletic program that failed to control the university, but the reverse.. Good Grief.

 

[gatordad3]

Do you suppose Baylor called f$u for advice?

Oops, that was a serious question.

 

[TheDouglas78]

Seriously? And you think I am out of my element. The institution in the lack of institutional control is the INSTITUTION OF HIGHER EDUCATION ie the college or university. It is not the athletic program that failed to control the university, but the reverse.. Good Grief.

So according to you a coach can't be penalized for "lack of Institutional control"? Really?

You might want to talk to Miami former basketball coach when he was found guility for not reporting his assistant coaches.

The former head men's basketball coach failed to meet his responsibilities as a head coach when he did not monitor the activities of his assistant coaches, and attempted to cover up the booster's threats to disclose incriminating information, according to the committee. Additionally, two assistant football coaches and one assistant men’s basketball coach did not follow NCAA ethical conduct rules.

Much like the Baylor incident, he wasn't the only one to resign/get fired over this... see Ken Star. Yes, a coach can be charged with it.

http://www.cbssports.com/college-fo...-notable-lack-of-institutional-control-cases/

 

[Ancient Reptile]

Wasn't Briles accused of meeting with accusers and their families to try to convince them to not press charges? That alone is grounds for firing and probation.

I quite agree, fire Briles. It is interesting how much norms have changed. A former politico used attorneys for intimidation, got affidavits denying what happened did happen, lied on national TV, and is still celebrated for his behavior.

 

[InstiGATOR1]

Ummm Baylor published the report, I put a link in my post so you could edumucate yourself.....

And if you bothered to actually read your link you should know that is not the law firm's report but a summary. Baylor has not released the report, if there is a fully written report, and continues to be criticized for NOT releasing the report by the media. But of course I need to "edumucate" myself from the link in your post you apparently either did not read or did not understand.

 

[InstiGATOR1]

So according to you a coach can't be penalized for "lack of Institutional control"? Really?

You might want to talk to Miami former basketball coach when he was found guility for not reporting his assistant coaches.

Failure to monitor one's employees who break rules has long been an NCAA violation. However since a person is not an institution, THAT IS NOT LACK OF INSTITUTIONAL CONTROL. Lack of institutional control is again the failure of the institution, i.e. University of Miami to maintain control over its athletic program. Those are two very different things.