- Nov 9, 2015
- 7,401
- 4,168
Or even more broadly our entire culture or at least some subcultures where many male athletes for major sports come from.
Great Article about Mullen's "Culture Problem" at UF
- Thread starter GatorTom85
- Start date
Or even more broadly our entire culture or at least some subcultures where many male athletes for major sports come from.
- Jul 2, 2014
- 6,072
- 13,838
Pre. Enlisted in Feb 01, got to my first duty station in Nov, left for Saudi in Jan of 02
Last edited:
- Jun 13, 2014
- 25,242
- 10,084
Founding Member
Sounds like PC stuff now based on when I was in. Some of the best soldiers were ones that just had GEDs but back then stuff off duty wouldn't get you kicked out like now.
- Jul 30, 2014
- 10,131
- 16,377
My dad is fairly certain his Army drill Sgt dropped out of 8th grade (this was back in the 50s). Now, it's somewhat common to have CG recruits with Bachelor degrees. Education is good, but sometimes it's hard for a college graduate to stay motivated while doing the dirty work associated with being at entry level in the military. Not always, but it happens.
- Jan 2, 2018
- 7,032
- 10,100
Standards were stricter when you went through. Seems like all MEPS does now is weed out serious medical conditions. Boot camp gets kids barely able to pass the physical standards. A school/entry level training/etc does just enough to pass kids off to their first command so they can “learn on the job”. Then we wonder why these guys aren’t proficient in their career field three years later after they’ve been rapidly advanced because they’re good test takers.
NovaGator
Well-Known Member
- Dec 10, 2015
- 631
- 561
In major college sports, the old adage "winning isn't everything: It's the only thing" seems more true than ever.
Established coaches have to live with the aspect of "what have you done for us lately? New coaches are on a shorter leash than ever. Huge buyout provisions mean nothing. The alumni will always come up with the money to unload an under-performing coach. So coaches cut corners, look the other way, find ways to sweep things under the rug, recruit players with inordinate numbers of red flags. College presidents do little to curb abuses. Alumni donations and ticket sales are driven in large part by athletic success. The NCAA is a joke. They bluster and fume, but nobody cares all that much. It has to follow the directives of the presidents. Don't look for things to change any time soon.
Years ago, when I was in college, you would get kicked out for under-aged drinking. Nowadays, you almost have to kill somebody before getting booted. And even then, if you're a star athlete, you would be told to clean up your act and come back and see us in 6 months. Failing that, there is always the 2ed, 3ed, 4th, and last chance schools welcoming you with open arms. It's no wonder so many now have a sense of entitlement.
Last edited:
- Jun 14, 2014
- 25,397
- 29,513
Founding Member
I think WWII's "Best Generation" showed that the best teaching occurs all alone solving a problem configuring by hand and figuring by common sense, to get it done to put it to use. No crowded classroom pretense, just do it or redo it.
- Oct 5, 2014
- 7,099
- 16,066
I remember when coaches would tell players to get a haircut and shave off all facial hair, no mustaches, no beards, hair cut off the collar. But now as you so well state in your post the inmates are running the asylum. And the fans don't care as long as the team is winning. The head coaches make more than the college president so which way do you think the balance of power leans there.
- Aug 11, 2015
- 8,316
- 15,956
With Huggins gone, that’s 4 of 4 players plus one staff member booted for alleged domestic violence issues. I’m glad for the responses but concerned that we’ve had 5 such incidents since Mullen arrived. He’s got to correct course on his evaluation process.
- Jun 19, 2014
- 21,513
- 48,215
Founding Member
ding ding ding... Need to do better evaluating the character of these kids, or start signing talent in bulk to make up for attrition for off field issues. It's one or the other if we want to get back to competing.
- Mar 22, 2016
- 394
- 697
This article pretty much sums up my opinion on this:
This man’s opinion: Mullen and staff are 5-for-5
Though I agree that the vetting process needs to be refined, stupid decisions in the heat of the moment by 18-22 year old kids are a risk at every program and there is only so much a head coach can do to prevent this type of thing when these kids are on their own. This is especially true when you consider that a lot of these kids come from rough backgrounds and have also often lived entitled lives prior to college having been stud football players throughout their playing days prior to arriving on campus. It also doesn't help at all that coaches now have their time with players so restricted.
Given all of these factors, the most effective prevention model available is to make it clear that these types of incidents are not going to be tolerated on this team. I think it sends a pretty strong message in that direction when the 5 incidents against women, even with no charges officially filed, ended up with 5 dismissals especially when that group includes a member of the coaching staff.
As Mullen says, decision making is the key. Hopefully this type of consistent response will help drive it into the heads of these kids to think of the consequences before acting when they feel "provoked" by a woman going forward.
This man’s opinion: Mullen and staff are 5-for-5
Though I agree that the vetting process needs to be refined, stupid decisions in the heat of the moment by 18-22 year old kids are a risk at every program and there is only so much a head coach can do to prevent this type of thing when these kids are on their own. This is especially true when you consider that a lot of these kids come from rough backgrounds and have also often lived entitled lives prior to college having been stud football players throughout their playing days prior to arriving on campus. It also doesn't help at all that coaches now have their time with players so restricted.
Given all of these factors, the most effective prevention model available is to make it clear that these types of incidents are not going to be tolerated on this team. I think it sends a pretty strong message in that direction when the 5 incidents against women, even with no charges officially filed, ended up with 5 dismissals especially when that group includes a member of the coaching staff.
As Mullen says, decision making is the key. Hopefully this type of consistent response will help drive it into the heads of these kids to think of the consequences before acting when they feel "provoked" by a woman going forward.
- Jan 2, 2018
- 7,032
- 10,100
3 of those 5 were Mullen guys. Watkins was a risk he took because it was a transition class but Yelverton and Jones were choices he made. He’s got to vet better in the future.
- Mar 22, 2016
- 394
- 697
I agree that vetting potential recruits needs further refinement but improved vetting really should always be a continual improvement process. Unfortunately, however, it is unrealistic to think any vetting process is going to be 100% effective in weeding out candidates who could fall prey to this issue. That's one reason I think Mullen prefers to recruit guys over multiple years in HS so he and his staff can get a more complete read on the character of those they recruit. Even if the vetting is improved 10 fold, however, we are still talking about 18-22 year old kids many of whom come from tough backgrounds where they haven't necessarily been taught proper behavior toward women. What's worse is that some of the best candidates may have also been protected from incidents of this nature due to the same kind of win at all costs mentality that applies at the HS level too. In those cases the incidents in question could be hidden from potential recruiters too so vetting may not be as effective as one would like. There is also the potential at any time for kids that age, even those that are usually very rational, to make emotional and irrational decisions relative to volatile relationships and this can lead to incidents of this nature especially for highly trained athletes who play a violent sport because a split second poor decision can lead to a hospital visit for the recipient.
Therefore, though constant improvements in vetting should always be an objective, a consistent policy for no tolerance is still the best last line of defense deterrent, especially for super stars, because it is much more likely to help them practice self control if they know they are likely to lose their scholarship and their potential shot at the next level if a violent incident occurs with a woman or any other "civilian" for that matter.
