G8RATL
Master of My Domain
- Aug 14, 2015
- 132
- 1
Just lost respect for Tabor
- Thread starter Slug
- Start date
- Sep 9, 2014
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There's a lot of risk for Universities related to CFB right now. It used to be there were the top 15 or so programs with huge budgets, huge stadiums, and high paid coaches. Everyone else was satisfied with having a small or medium sized program and trying to climb the ranks through developing upper-classmen and hopefully getting a breakthrough talent that was a local product or that the big boys missed on, that could propel you to competing for the big prize.
But times have changed. Budgets have exploded with every program in a big 5 conference (any many out of the big 5) having no choice but to try to compete by paying 3 million plus for a coach and another million plus for assistant coaches. Facility wars are out of control with schools that can't really afford to, borrowing tens of millions to build new or updated stadiums, dorms, lounges, practice facilities, etc to try to compete with the big-dogs in their conference. They'll be paying for these projects for decades in some cases and their new shiny facilities will be obsolete long before the dept is paid. Look how quickly Urban's facility upgrades went from great to near the bottom of the SEC as everyone else kept borrowing and building.
Recruiting budgets are at all time highs and growing yearly. The majority of sports on campuses lose money yet the cost to run those programs keeps growing way beyond the rate of inflation.
While everyone is mortgaging their programs based on assumed future growth and success, the game itself is dealing with crisis regularly with more and more scientific data highlighting the dangers, along with high profile players sharing personal stories of debilitation and regret for having participated in the game we love, some even sharing post-mortem after suicide which really has shock-value. Hell, even Hollywood is jumping on board.
With the way the players just keep getting bigger, faster, and stronger, are efforts to reduce the number of serious injuries just lip service and a CYA attempt by the NFL? It comes down to simple physics and no new helmet can change the fact that the forces generated by the size and speed of these guys colliding leading to almost instant deceleration is beyond the threshold of energy the head and it's contents can safely absorb. Unless you make the helmets 3 feet wide with crumple zones, the concussion issue isn't going away. Imagine just one year where the number of serious injuries or even deaths is a couple of standard deviations above the norm, a variance you expect periodically. It could do huge harm to the public's already wavering perception of football overall.
Anyway, long rambling post but the point is the players are getting compensated very well if they take advantage of the free education and half a billion might sound like a lot of money but it's really not when you consider the details and risk the Universities are accepting.
But times have changed. Budgets have exploded with every program in a big 5 conference (any many out of the big 5) having no choice but to try to compete by paying 3 million plus for a coach and another million plus for assistant coaches. Facility wars are out of control with schools that can't really afford to, borrowing tens of millions to build new or updated stadiums, dorms, lounges, practice facilities, etc to try to compete with the big-dogs in their conference. They'll be paying for these projects for decades in some cases and their new shiny facilities will be obsolete long before the dept is paid. Look how quickly Urban's facility upgrades went from great to near the bottom of the SEC as everyone else kept borrowing and building.
Recruiting budgets are at all time highs and growing yearly. The majority of sports on campuses lose money yet the cost to run those programs keeps growing way beyond the rate of inflation.
While everyone is mortgaging their programs based on assumed future growth and success, the game itself is dealing with crisis regularly with more and more scientific data highlighting the dangers, along with high profile players sharing personal stories of debilitation and regret for having participated in the game we love, some even sharing post-mortem after suicide which really has shock-value. Hell, even Hollywood is jumping on board.
With the way the players just keep getting bigger, faster, and stronger, are efforts to reduce the number of serious injuries just lip service and a CYA attempt by the NFL? It comes down to simple physics and no new helmet can change the fact that the forces generated by the size and speed of these guys colliding leading to almost instant deceleration is beyond the threshold of energy the head and it's contents can safely absorb. Unless you make the helmets 3 feet wide with crumple zones, the concussion issue isn't going away. Imagine just one year where the number of serious injuries or even deaths is a couple of standard deviations above the norm, a variance you expect periodically. It could do huge harm to the public's already wavering perception of football overall.
Anyway, long rambling post but the point is the players are getting compensated very well if they take advantage of the free education and half a billion might sound like a lot of money but it's really not when you consider the details and risk the Universities are accepting.
Ancient Reptile
Senior Member
- Mar 4, 2015
- 10,802
- 11,128
"Around the horn" (ESPN) backed Tabor solidly, demurring only a little on the slavery metaphor.
- Aug 31, 2014
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Why bash the kid for having an opinion, even if you disagree with it? Yes the slave analogy was poor but its not like its a completely out of line opinion? At least one that merits calling him a moron, retard or all the other names. Look, it's certainly worth a discussion with crazy amount of cash that is coming in to these major programs. Some very respected people in the sport including SOS support changing when it comes to cash and the student athlete.
- Jun 13, 2014
- 12,702
- 22,997
Founding Member
Quite simply, the system is set up the way it is and if you don't like it you are free to start your own NFL minor league. Getting the equivalent of around $60,000 or more per year in benefits to play or sit the bench on a college team is very reasonable when compared to other minor league sports. Like I said, if the fact that the university spends money marketing you, training you and increasing your chances of making millions in the NFL is considered "slavery" to you then you are welcome to explore other options like going the free agent route. It's a free country. Best of luck with that.
- Jun 12, 2014
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Founding Member
It's not an opinion. It's lunacy. I really don't think these kids have any idea of what slavery actually entailed. I can tell you this...
* Slavery never included a free college education, plush accommodations, millionaire coaches kissing your arse to get you to come and "play" for them
* It didn't come with free tutors to help you and encourage you to achieve academic success
* It never included hot coeds throwing themselves at your feet at every turn
* It didn't come with a stadium full of 90,000 + people cheering for you and along with the millions more watching television at home
* It didn't include arcade games, leather couches, flat screen tv's and a smoothie bar
* It didn't include countless people tending to your every need and a nutritionist who builds a diet of free and delicious foods to help you reach the peak of your abilities
* It didn't come with a multi million dollar contract to play a sport as your job if indeed your abilities are maximized by coaching, training, medical care, and proper nutrition
* It didn't come with the ability to start adult life debt free, while countless others are saddled with tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans.
* It didn't come with a chance to live a childhood dream that most every American boy fantasized about while growing up
* And once you're done playing the game you love, it certainly didn't come without the almost certain guarantee of a job waiting for you by some UF alumni manager, executive or business owner.
Yeah... I feel real sorry for these poor kids having to suffer through this form of modern day slavery...
If it's just an opinion, as you describe it, I'd say it's a disgraceful one... that is to the ones who actually endured slavery.
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- Jun 19, 2014
- 21,669
- 48,647
Founding Member
It's not an opinion. It's lunacy. I really don't think these kids have any idea of what slavery actually entailed. I can tell you this...
* Slavery never included a free college education, plush accommodations, millionaire coaches kissing your arse to get you to come and "play" for them
* It didn't come with free tutors to help you and encourage you to achieve academic success
* It never included hot coeds throwing themselves at your feet at every turn
* It didn't come with a stadium full of 90,000 + people cheering for you and along with the millions more watching television at home
* It didn't include arcade games, leather couches, flat screen tv's and a smoothie bar
* It didn't include countless people tending to your every need and a nutritionist who builds a diet of free and delicious foods to help you reach the peak of your abilities
* It didn't come with a multi million dollar contract to play a sport as your job if indeed your abilities are maximized by coaching, training, medical care, and proper nutrition
* It didn't come with the ability to start adult life debt free, while countless others are saddled with tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans.
* It didn't come with a chance to live a childhood dream that most every American boy fantasized about while growing up
* And once you're done playing the game you love, it certainly didn't come without the almost certain guarantee of a job waiting for you by some UF alumni manager, executive or business owner.
Yeah... I feel real sorry for these poor kids having to suffer through this form of modern day slavery...
If it's just an opinion, as you describe it, I'd say it's a disgraceful one... that is to the ones who actually endured slavery.
I wish there was enough "like" on the internet for this post, but there isn't. Anyone who thinks the opinion that CFB is modern day slavery is a valid, understandable, debatable or even anything less than absolute asinine one is absolutely bat-sh*t crazy. Did I say no one can have that opinion? Nope. Did I say no one can be understanding of someone who has that opinion? Nope... but both of you are freakin bat-sh*t crazy if you feel that way. Period.
- Jun 12, 2014
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Tabor is part of a massive movement in the country that believes that everything is for them or should be.
He did not come up with this on his own, he heard it from the talking heads on ESPN
- Any kid that feels this way places no value on education and then wonders why they lose all their money.
- Jalen should try going to school like all the other students that don't get everything given to them.
- Once he got crap, he didn't really apologize he said "you know where I am coming from"
- Why bash him? Because if a kid came out on the other side of this issue he would be crucified on social media. Why should the response be different based upon which side of the issue you are on?
He did not come up with this on his own, he heard it from the talking heads on ESPN
- Any kid that feels this way places no value on education and then wonders why they lose all their money.
- Jalen should try going to school like all the other students that don't get everything given to them.
- Once he got crap, he didn't really apologize he said "you know where I am coming from"
- Why bash him? Because if a kid came out on the other side of this issue he would be crucified on social media. Why should the response be different based upon which side of the issue you are on?
- Jun 12, 2014
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- Jun 14, 2014
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My worry is that this may grow into what happened at the U of Missouri... players can
hitch their greed to racism tides and threaten to boycott, shut down games. UF would
have to pay the travel school, refund ticket holders without any income flow to offset it.
Look for Flo & Progressive ads for University insurance protection from your CFB players.
- Jun 12, 2014
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Founding Member
I am with you Rogdochar.
That is my concern too. We are soooooo afraid to speak candidly to people when they are full of it which only leads to them thinking their position is righteous. We must nip this crap in the bud or be prepared to suffer the consequences if left unchecked.
That is my concern too. We are soooooo afraid to speak candidly to people when they are full of it which only leads to them thinking their position is righteous. We must nip this crap in the bud or be prepared to suffer the consequences if left unchecked.
- Jun 13, 2014
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Founding Member
If they think it's slavery then set them free! Release them from their self-imposed slavery and let them see how the real world works. Solve the problem right there and no threat of a boycott.
- Aug 31, 2014
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You do understand the difference between an analogy and an opinion? The analogy was slavery is like playing college football, poor analogy. The opinion is players should be seeing more benefit from the millions of dollars that they are generating.It's not an opinion. It's lunacy. I really don't think these kids have any idea of what slavery actually entailed. I can tell you this...
* Slavery never included a free college education, plush accommodations, millionaire coaches kissing your arse to get you to come and "play" for them
* It didn't come with free tutors to help you and encourage you to achieve academic success
* It never included hot coeds throwing themselves at your feet at every turn
* It didn't come with a stadium full of 90,000 + people cheering for you and along with the millions more watching television at home
* It didn't include arcade games, leather couches, flat screen tv's and a smoothie bar
* It didn't include countless people tending to your every need and a nutritionist who builds a diet of free and delicious foods to help you reach the peak of your abilities
* It didn't come with a multi million dollar contract to play a sport as your job if indeed your abilities are maximized by coaching, training, medical care, and proper nutrition
* It didn't come with the ability to start adult life debt free, while countless others are saddled with tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans.
* It didn't come with a chance to live a childhood dream that most every American boy fantasized about while growing up
* And once you're done playing the game you love, it certainly didn't come without the almost certain guarantee of a job waiting for you by some UF alumni manager, executive or business owner.
Yeah... I feel real sorry for these poor kids having to suffer through this form of modern day slavery...
If it's just an opinion, as you describe it, I'd say it's a disgraceful one... that is to the ones who actually endured slavery.
- Aug 31, 2014
- 1,305
- 1,859
The money that is being generated by college football is not "minor league sports" money. The money is closer to professional level sports. If its so "asinine" and "lunacy" then why is the NCAA considering it? Why do people like SOS support it? Yes, the ANALOGY of slavery is incorrect, but so many are getting focused on that versus the opinion that he and others are bringing up.
- Jun 13, 2014
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Founding Member
While working nearly full time as well as using student loans, pell grants and being extremely poor while attending UF, I would have loved to have been exploited to get a free tuition, food and lodging.
Yes I understand the whole money issue but they are going into college football with eyes wide open. They know how it works. And they are being paid with school, food and lodging. Do you really think workers at companies that rake in millions make more money just because the company does?
Yes I understand the whole money issue but they are going into college football with eyes wide open. They know how it works. And they are being paid with school, food and lodging. Do you really think workers at companies that rake in millions make more money just because the company does?
- Jun 13, 2014
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SOS supports a stipend of a couple hundred dollars a month in addition to free meals, board, tuition, books, health care, etc. Do you actually think that players will be happy with a couple hundred dollars a month when, as you say, colleges are "making millions" (although only a very few athletic programs are in the black)? How do propose to handle women's lacrosse players when they start demanding money too? I take it you've heard of Title IX? Do you pay "marquee" players more than bench warmers? Because you KNOW that will be demanded eventually. What do you say to the LA Techs and East Carolina's of the world when they find out that tuition and board aren't enough and now they will be going deeper into the red because they will have to pay all of their athletes? Are you a season ticket holder? Are you willing to pay $500 more a year for your tickets?
I used the minor league analogy because that's exactly what college football is. If these guys want to get paid cash while preparing for the NFL (even though very, very few actually make it) they can form their own minor league and see how profitable that is and how much exposure it provides for them. And they won't have to worry about going to school and actually having a future in anything other than football. Or, as I said before, they can forgo college and avoid the "indentured servitude" and go the free agent tryout route. No one is forcing them to stay.
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- Aug 31, 2014
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Except they can't. Fournette, Cook, etal can't go the free agent route if they wanted to. Nor could any high school stud. So would you be in support of removing that restriction? I would.
Yes, SOS supports the concept of paying players, albeit a small amount, but nonetheless the willingness to support that idea makes the point valid or at least gives that opinion credibility (the opinion that there is a problem).
I understand the "other sports" argument and I agree that it is a huge challenge, but that doesnt mean we just ignore the problem and say "oh well". My thought, is that the major programs will eventually break away from the NCAA, form their own league/entity/whatever that will shield them from Title IX limitations.
