Tampontreal Exprays?

T REX

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I was a season ticket holder in 06 which I first moved to the area. The problem for the Rays is they have routinely put up an inferior product, and let talented players moving to their second/third contract go. As mentioned above they started removing Season Ticket benefits event to corporate sponsors (the company I work for was one). Their are substitute products in the area. Within driving distance from the ball park, you can see the Clearwater Threshers (A+ Phillies), Tampa Tarpons (A+ Yankees), Dunnedin Blue Jays (A+ Blue Jays), etc... with a family of four for the price of parking to see a Rays game, with better deals for the fans. The Rays also poorly market themselves to the local/tourist fans coming through the area. I see more Clearwater Thresher Billboards and TV advertisements than I do for the Rays on the local networks (only have antenna after NCAA Tournament).

The Rays built this mess by the poor management and not understanding the area. Also having great ownership with the lightening and a legacy organization in the Bucs... the question is can the area truly support three Major Professional Sport franchises.

I think the Lightning have sold out 158 consecutive reg season games...at 19k+, so they'll come. The geographic location(St Pete far from the population center) and the lack of baseball attracting younger fans is a huge huge problem going forward in any area in FL.

Stu is talking crap at 1 pm today.
 

Gatorbreath

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Stu is talking crap at 1 pm today.

I can see Stu's convincing you of, um, anything, is going to be a tall order. :lol:

I wonder if he's going to come right out and say that the Tampa Bay area simply cannot or will not support the team, effectively formally beginning the process of leaving the area. Guess we'll see in a bit.
 
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T REX

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I turned it off...he started off talking about how much baseball means to him then had their community relations guy come up and list off all the good they have done for the community...then he proceeded to tell us how we are made up of regional areas and not enough Fortune 500 companies. The area cannot sustain MLB for 81 home games. He says this isn't a ploy to gain leverage and he's moving forward with the plan to split games between the two cities. What you aren't hearing is that once St Pete falls off because they aren't going to pay for his stadium...then he will be "forced" to move the team. He's setting this up as he did everything he could(except pay for his own ****). F you Stu. POS.
 

Gatorbreath

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F you Stu. POS.

I agree this idea is silly. I am still watching the stream. And maybe you're right - this may be a step in the direction of an exit from the area. He literally just said he will not sell the team under any circumstances - even if this idea fails.

I don't get your vitriol to the owner. The bottom line is, he provided a winner and the area has not supported the team. Further, the area apparently won't pony up for a stadium. I think he's been reasonable.

Given size of the area, I remain hopeful a stadium will get built in Tampa and the team will stay for 81 games.
 

T REX

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I agree this idea is silly. I am still watching the stream. And maybe you're right - this may be a step in the direction of an exit from the area. He literally just said he will not sell the team under any circumstances - even if this idea fails.

I don't get your vitriol to the owner. The bottom line is, he provided a winner and the area has not supported the team. Further, the area apparently won't pony up for a stadium. I think he's been reasonable.

Given size of the area, I remain hopeful a stadium will get built in Tampa and the team will stay for 81 games.

He flat out just said that they aren't going to play 81 games here. This is a step towards relocation. Anyone can see it. Maybe he's right. Baseball is a dying sport anyhow. And what are the Rays ever gonna win? They can never spend like the Yanks or Sox. We are a feeder team for other MLB teams. We never sign any of our studs. They walk and we are forced into an always rebuilding circle of new names after new name. I'm done with the Rays and baseball in general.

The sport is dying anyhow. It can die up in Montreal.
 

Gatorbreath

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Holy crap. He just stated directly that baseball for 81 games cannot work in St. Pete, period. And he said he really doubts it can work in Tampa, that "he's seen the numbers".

Wow. That's as close to a nuke as you can get...........
 

T REX

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Holy crap. He just stated directly that baseball for 81 games cannot work in St. Pete, period. And he said he really doubts it can work in Tampa, that "he's seen the numbers".

Wow. That's as close to a nuke as you can get...........
:boom:
 

Gatorbreath

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Damn. I just logged off. It feels like ownership has given up on the area.
 
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T REX

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Damn. I just logged off. If feels like ownership has given up on the area.

Why list off all the good things you've done for the area? That was weird and you had to know bad news was gonna follow all of that self aggrandizement.
 

NavetG8r

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For some reason, after reading the thread title, I was expecting it to be a women's team.
 

KronoGator

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Damn. I just logged off. It feels like ownership has given up on the area.
Of course, the area won't give the billionaire a handout.

Quebec won't either but they are so desperate for the Expos2 that big corporations will.

Two baseball teams in Florida was always a mistake, should have been 1 spending 1/3 of the season in Orlando,Tampa,Miami.
 

Gatorbreath

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Two baseball teams in Florida was always a mistake, should have been 1 spending 1/3 of the season in Orlando,Tampa,Miami.

The Tampa Bay area has close to 3.5M people and the state has over 20M. It easily has enough people to support two baseball teams.

Rex's argument about baseball being a dying game - and your own about taxpayer vs corporate support to fund a stadium are more persuasive, IMO.

I don't know if the game can work in Tampa. And I'd agree that its chances probably got a lot worse with today's presser. I see the point about taxpayer funded playgrounds for millionaires and billionaires. It is an easily defensible policy position to take.

I still think sports teams bind a city or region the way few other things can. If you're a white dude strolling down Kennedy Blvd. with your Rays or Lightning jersey on and you come across a black guy walking in the opposite direction wearing gear from the same team, there's an instant, (if fleeting) connection. He's not only some douche you have to push past, a leech on the system, as you weave your way through pedestrian traffic, and you're not just some entitled white cracker to him. You'll toss each other a nod, or at least be a little less annoyed by one another based on your shared allegiance. Communities rally around their teams. In a time when we are all being pulled apart seemingly constantly, these little things that help bind a community matter just a bit more. How a community quantifies that with its taxpayer dollars for a stadium, I don't know. But it should factor in.

The Tampa MSA is the second largest in Florida behind Miami and is among the fastest growing in the nation. Why, with that heat and humidity, I'll never know, but that's a topic for another thread. Look at the cities that recently lost major pro sports teams and how they yearn to get them back: Cleveland got a reconstituted Browns franchise back, after their franchise went to replace the relocated Colts. Montreal with baseball, Winnipeg got hockey back. Quebec wants hockey back. Seattle wants basketball back. Hell, isn't Tampa trying to join MLS after losing the Mutiny years ago? And getting a team back - be it through expansion or relocation - is always far more expensive and always includes the stadium/arena the original team wanted in the first place. If the Rays leave and we're still all on this crummy board a few years from now, I'll bet Tampa is neck deep in trying to woo MLB for an expansion team, or to relocate one. And this time, "they'll do it right!".

Both sides need to step back and see what they have mutually invested. There's been a generation spent of building fans and allegiances and strong TV ratings in the largest area that can realistically support a team (Charlotte, Vegas, Nashville, Portland). It's best for all to make it work here.
 

T REX

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The Tampa Bay area has close to 3.5M people and the state has over 20M. It easily has enough people to support two baseball teams.

Rex's argument about baseball being a dying game - and your own about taxpayer vs corporate support to fund a stadium are more persuasive, IMO.

I don't know if the game can work in Tampa. And I'd agree that its chances probably got a lot worse with today's presser. I see the point about taxpayer funded playgrounds for millionaires and billionaires. It is an easily defensible policy position to take.

I still think sports teams bind a city or region the way few other things can. If you're a white dude strolling down Kennedy Blvd. with your Rays or Lightning jersey on and you come across a black guy walking in the opposite direction wearing gear from the same team, there's an instant, (if fleeting) connection. He's not only some douche you have to push past, a leech on the system, as you weave your way through pedestrian traffic, and you're not just some entitled white cracker to him. You'll toss each other a nod, or at least be a little less annoyed by one another based on your shared allegiance. Communities rally around their teams. In a time when we are all being pulled apart seemingly constantly, these little things that help bind a community matter just a bit more. How a community quantifies that with its taxpayer dollars for a stadium, I don't know. But it should factor in.

The Tampa MSA is the second largest in Florida behind Miami and is among the fastest growing in the nation. Why, with that heat and humidity, I'll never know, but that's a topic for another thread. Look at the cities that recently lost major pro sports teams and how they yearn to get them back: Cleveland got a reconstituted Browns franchise back, after their franchise went to replace the relocated Colts. Montreal with baseball, Winnipeg got hockey back. Quebec wants hockey back. Seattle wants basketball back. Hell, isn't Tampa trying to join MLS after losing the Mutiny years ago? And getting a team back - be it through expansion or relocation - is always far more expensive and always includes the stadium/arena the original team wanted in the first place. If the Rays leave and we're still all on this crummy board a few years from now, I'll bet Tampa is neck deep in trying to woo MLB for an expansion team, or to relocate one. And this time, "they'll do it right!".

Both sides need to step back and see what they have mutually invested. There's been a generation spent of building fans and allegiances and strong TV ratings in the largest area that can realistically support a team (Charlotte, Vegas, Nashville, Portland). It's best for all to make it work here.
I don't disagree with anything you said. Here's the problem...we have so many infrastructure problems that people aren't going to support corporate welfare. Contrary to Stu's presser...he has done little to endear himself to the area. Hell, he JUST NOW bought a house here. He's a season ticket holder for the Mets...lol. Come on...who wants to build that azzhole a stadium? If Vinik bought the team...I guarantee you a 1% tax would pass with flying colors in Hillsborough. No problem because we KNOW Jeff is a class act and we TRUST him. I do not trust Stu the carpetbagger. F him.
 

TheDouglas78

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I don't disagree with anything you said. Here's the problem...we have so many infrastructure problems that people aren't going to support corporate welfare. Contrary to Stu's presser...he has done little to endear himself to the area. Hell, he JUST NOW bought a house here. He's a season ticket holder for the Mets...lol. Come on...who wants to build that azzhole a stadium? If Vinik bought the team...I guarantee you a 1% tax would pass with flying colors in Hillsborough. No problem because we KNOW Jeff is a class act and we TRUST him. I do not trust Stu the carpetbagger. F him.

T Rex is getting a like for using carpetbagger correctly...
 

78

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Whether you like Stuart Steinberg or not means little. How much do you love MLB in your backyard and how much are you willing to bet on it with your wallet?

The Trop is a second-rate venue. The Rays are gone if someone doesn't come up with an aggressive financial plan to keep them in place. There is zero wrong with Steinberg posturing for something better. Everyone else does.

Get with it or get out, Tampa Bay.
 

KronoGator

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Yeah they want a new stadium to stay but nobody should pretend that a new stadium will change jack in regards to payroll or attendance, just look at the Marlins or Reds or Pirates.
 

T REX

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Whether you like Stuart Steinberg or not means little. How much do you love MLB in your backyard and how much are you willing to bet on it with your wallet?

The Trop is a second-rate venue. The Rays are gone if someone doesn't come up with an aggressive financial plan to keep them in place. There is zero wrong with Steinberg posturing for something better. Everyone else does.

Get with it or get out, Tampa Bay.

The area will probably get out. There just isn't enough corporate sponsorship here. Most baseball teams have 2/3rds of there tickets go to corporations. We are at 1/3rd. No one here will vote for a tax hike to pay for a billionaire's stadium. Bad timing.
 

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Nobody wants to sit in rush hour traffic on one of the bridges to go sit in a dump of a stadium with no atmosphere in downtown St. Pete. Everything else aside, that's the main issue.
 

78

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Nobody wants to sit in rush hour traffic on one of the bridges to go sit in a dump of a stadium with no atmosphere in downtown St. Pete. Everything else aside, that's the main issue.
Getting to the South Bronx, the North Side of Chicago or downtown Boston is equally challenging if not more. You gotta want to go. The Trop is bland but I've seen worse.

The summer is a hot, wet mess in FLA and yet there are only so many days of the regular season that can justify the added cost of a retractable-roof stadium.

I'm pretty sure MLB is dead here, which is a shame. We're one big paradox. So many of us love baseball. So many of us who love baseball are older and attached to a team "from up North."

I love the Rays. I love the Lightning. The Bucs can kiss my ass.
 

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