Will Winston finish at FSU or be kicked out?

[Circle City Gator]

NFL teams aren't going to draft him in the first half of Round 1. Not now. Not with this history.

 

[ThreatMatrix]

You know there was another guy in that room. Which to me is a little

 

[Jenny On The Railroad]

I want you guys to understand what's going on here. There are two different investigations.

The first is an internal FSU investigation regarding the rape. Title IX requires schools to promptly and thoroughly investigate such claims and resolve them in about 60 days. The burden is "preponderance of the evidence" which means more likely than not.

The second is a DOJ investigation of FSU to see if FSU did in fact comply with Title IX.

The internal investigation has a low burden of proof but it had equally low punishment powers. Chris Casher (who admitted to videotaping the incident) was put on probation for a year. Basically nuthin. The other "witness" got off scot free. So what might happen to Winston as a result? If they decide it is more likely that he didn't rape her, nothing. If they decide it is more likely that he did rape her, the most they can do is expel him (in which case he sues them and probably gets an injunction allowing him to remain enrolled until the case is resolved). I don't know what FSU is going to do here, but the pressure is going to be on them to rule in Winston's favor.

The DOJ investigation is likely to determine that FSU failed to act in accordance with Title IX requirements. You have the decidedly unthorough investigation, a meeting with Winston without the victim being able to rebut, the long delay, etc. In its defense, FSU claims the victim decided not to cooperate with the internal investigation, hence the delay. On the other hand, this lack of cooperation is likely due to FSU clearly trying to sweep this under the rug. I think FSU loses here but what does that mean? The absolute worst the government can do is cut off funding. No death penalty. It can't take away wins or bowl games or scholarships, can't put a team on probation or suspend any coaches or players. Title IX is all about federal funding. Schools receiving federal funding have to yada yada yada. Cutting such funding has never happened in the past, despite some egregious cases (remember the Colorado case?). The typical punishments are like coming up with a new protocol for dealing with accusations, hiring some staff, reporting requirements, etc.

If I had to guess (and these are wild guesses, not educated guesses)--

If it looks like FSU might play for a NC and the ruling comes out before that, Winston will likely be exonerated. This is the most likely scenario. If it looks like FSU is out of the NC hunt, or if the ruling comes out after the NC game, then Winston will be expelled and will declare for the draft.

The DOJ investigation will find that FSU failed to comply with the Title IX requirements but the punishment will be minor.

The victim will sue FSU and will walk away with $1M give or take $250K.

Alex.

She has the SANE nurse's testimony. It is considered extremely credible in criminal court, and should carry weight in civil court. There are 7-11 pages of med records from hospital that SAO somehow forgot to include in the supposed unredacted report that detail pain meds and neuro- cognitive symptoms, ongong vomiting , other signs consistent with rape and heavily consistent with rape drugs, all of which were ignored and then excluded from public record by SAO .Also included copies of the forms labeled as being for victims of sexual assault with instructions, follow up , etc all identifying her medically as having been sexually assaulted. The SAO neglected to interview and include any testimony form the SANE nurse, who once again is legally considered very credible in court. . I would think that these SAO oversights plus some other significant omissions and refusals, (such as refusal to ID the urine or test the blood for rape drugs), wold suggest a cover up or incompetency and indirectly lend credence to the rape scenario.

I think her attorney's may have opted to not included the SAO for strategic reasons, but I expect the absence of the med records, and SANE nurse testimony to be brought up,while introducing them both into evidence.

 

[rogdochar]

Let's not forget the chance that FSU fails at being #1 and that Winston's performance drops below a few other
Heisman candidates. Lets see him take all that.

 

[HogtownGator]

The sooner the better. I live in a part of the country where people aren't passionate about college football, and they get Florida's public institutions mixed up, and the Rapist, TPD, and FSU have tainted me and every graduate of a Florida public university. For example, I have literally gone into a bar, asked for the Florida game to be put on, FSU game goes up and the bartender thinks it is mission accomplished.

 

[WobbleGator]

The sooner the better. I live in a part of the country where people aren't passionate about college football, and they get Florida's public institutions mixed up, and the Rapist, TPD, and FSU have tainted me and every graduate of a Florida public university. For example, I have literally gone into a bar, asked for the Florida game to be put on, FSU game goes up and the bartender thinks it is mission accomplished.

You poor bastard.

 

[Jake from State Farm]

He will rape us and then go to the Ravens.

Ravens don't need him...... oh wait, that's sarcasm.

(noun: sarcasm; plural noun: sarcasms: the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.)

 

[AlexDaGator]

I want you guys to understand what's going on here. There are two different investigations.

The first is an internal FSU investigation regarding the rape. Title IX requires schools to promptly and thoroughly investigate such claims and resolve them in about 60 days. The burden is "preponderance of the evidence" which means more likely than not.

The second is a DOJ investigation of FSU to see if FSU did in fact comply with Title IX.

The internal investigation has a low burden of proof but it had equally low punishment powers. Chris Casher (who admitted to videotaping the incident) was put on probation for a year. Basically nuthin. The other "witness" got off scot free. So what might happen to Winston as a result? If they decide it is more likely that he didn't rape her, nothing. If they decide it is more likely that he did rape her, the most they can do is expel him (in which case he sues them and probably gets an injunction allowing him to remain enrolled until the case is resolved). I don't know what FSU is going to do here, but the pressure is going to be on them to rule in Winston's favor.

The DOJ investigation is likely to determine that FSU failed to act in accordance with Title IX requirements. You have the decidedly unthorough investigation, a meeting with Winston without the victim being able to rebut, the long delay, etc. In its defense, FSU claims the victim decided not to cooperate with the internal investigation, hence the delay. On the other hand, this lack of cooperation is likely due to FSU clearly trying to sweep this under the rug. I think FSU loses here but what does that mean? The absolute worst the government can do is cut off funding. No death penalty. It can't take away wins or bowl games or scholarships, can't put a team on probation or suspend any coaches or players. Title IX is all about federal funding. Schools receiving federal funding have to yada yada yada. Cutting such funding has never happened in the past, despite some egregious cases (remember the Colorado case?). The typical punishments are like coming up with a new protocol for dealing with accusations, hiring some staff, reporting requirements, etc.

If I had to guess (and these are wild guesses, not educated guesses)--

If it looks like FSU might play for a NC and the ruling comes out before that, Winston will likely be exonerated. This is the most likely scenario. If it looks like FSU is out of the NC hunt, or if the ruling comes out after the NC game, then Winston will be expelled and will declare for the draft.

The DOJ investigation will find that FSU failed to comply with the Title IX requirements but the punishment will be minor.

The victim will sue FSU and will walk away with $1M give or take $250K.

Alex.

We're on the same side, Jenny. I was a prosecutor for years and I'd love to see Winston get what he deserves. If TPD had done a credible investigation, I'm pretty sure he would have been charged and probably convicted. But TPD didn't.

The problem is this...proof of a cover-up is not proof of a rape. She won't have much trouble proving the investigation was purposefully botched. My guess is TPD will hang the investigator out to dry as "going rogue". Even of he was told to "investigate" with a wink and a nod, as long as he doesn't have anything tangible against the department, TPD will get away with it. Regardless, this part is the easy part for her lawyers. Especially since Winston and the Investigator will probably have to testify. Aren't you dying to hear a detailed explanation of how Winston and his witnesses happened to be lawyered up from the start?

On the other hand, Winston's lawyers can reasonably argue that the investigation had nothing to do with the events of that evening. Winston wasn't the one investigating the allegations and is not responsible for the actions or inactions of TPD. TPD might have been covering up for a guilty man or covering up for an innocent man.

Her case against Winston is hard to prove because of the cover-up, but the fact of the cover-up isn't proof in her case against Winston.

Alex.