Grier vs Harris (Courtesy of Goldkamp)

[TheDouglas78]

Leak was a good QB, better than anybody we have now. Lots of teams have won championships with QBs like Leak under center. The thing that I think gets forgotten about Leak was how frustrating it was watching him sometimes. He would throw a great pass one minute and then look lost the next. Of particular note was how many time he ran out of bounds behind the LOS trying to avoid a sack instead of just throwing it away. I think he set a record in that regard.

^This... Leak was good, but not great. I do wonder how he would have been if he had the same OC for at least three years. The coaching and styles of offenses he ran were different in each of his first three years on the team. I think if he had SOS, Meyer, Hall, or even McElwain (too early to truly know what we have) he would be remembered in a better light. He would make some incredible plays, then throw to a linebacker in the chest in a panic a few plays later.

I'm not going to pretend like I was a huge Leak fan, but kid is given more grief than he deserved. He should never be mentioned in the same likes as Wuerfell or Tebow, but also wasn't a Berlin. He was good but not great in his time at UF.

 

[ItsDookie87]

Obviously we would all pick Grier if both were eligible - just like the coaches did. That said, there's a reason the starter wasn't decided before the season started. The difference between the two isn't as huge as some of the dumbasses here think it is.

Grier is more accurate, has a quicker release, and is much better at going through progressions. At the same time, he would start to tuck and run way too early and once he did he stopped looking for receivers. If the defense got to him a few times early, he would be in an absolute panic the rest of the game. But when Grier screwed up, everyone blamed the offensive line. Treon extends plays making the line look better (but his throws and decisions aren't as good) and everyone blames him. Stats say the end result is about the same.

I really don't think it was as close as you think, Mac knew that he needed Treon since we have no QB depth and by not giving him a shot he would have run the risk of losing Treon mentally and eventually to transfer. Mac made the right decision and it's paid off since Grier got suspended.

 

[Zambo]

The only thing so far that I've seen that Treon's better at would be keeping his eyes down the field when scrambling. Grier seemed to go through his progressions much faster and better, was more accurate and also consistent. I've seen Treon improving slowly but surely, he just isn't breaking out the way Grier did vs Ole Miss and 4th quarter Tennessee.

Grier rarely "scrambled" in the sense that he was ever buying time to throw the ball. He just took off and ran.

 

[TheBigClaw]

Grier rarely "scrambled" in the sense that he was ever buying time to throw the ball. He just took off and ran.

That's what I was suggesting. We've seen Treon take off and improvise to find someone down the field meanwhile if Grier scrambled, he was running no doubt about it.


Sent from my IPad using tapatalk.

 

[Gatorhunter]

What about comparing a true sophomore Leak and a true sophomore Treon.

Treon Harris
Freshman 49.5% 9 tds 4 ints 146.2 rating 4.4 ypc 3 tds
Sophomore 55.6% 6 tds 3 ints 134.8 rating 3.4 ypc 0 tds

Chris Leak
Freshman 59.4% 16 tds 11 ints 132.9 rating -.8 ypc 2 tds
Sophomre 59.6% 29 tds 12 ints 144.9 rating 1.3 ypc 2 tds

Thus far I prefer Leaks true sophomore numbers comparitively

Agreed, those stats do look better on the surface but by this time in their careers Leak had twice the starts as Treon. Leak's 2004 OL featured 3 jrs and 2 srs. Also Leak went 7-5 as a sophomore. Treon is 4-1 so far. That's one stat of Treon's that I prefer. I'm a big CL fan but comparing him and Treon is apples and oranges.

 

[GatorJB]

Here are some stats Goldkamp failed to mention:

Completion percentage: Grier 65% Harris 55%
Completions and Attempts: Grier 106/161; Harris 75/135
Sacks Grier 13; Harris 14
Total Touchdowns Grier 12; Harris 6

These are the eye candy stats that we notice. With Harris there are fewer completed passes, fewer touchdowns, and even more sacks.

All of that said, I am very happy Harris is a Gator and he isn't completely awful like some may suggest. I also noticed that Harris' accuracy and completion percentage has improved over the last 3 games and that trend will likely go up this week. So he is getting better and we are still winning games. Hopefully Mac will continue to coach him up so we can continue this winning streak.

 

[TheDouglas78]

Agreed, those stats do look better on the surface but by this time in their careers Leak had twice the starts as Treon. Leak's 2004 OL featured 3 jrs and 2 srs. Also Leak went 7-5 as a sophomore. Treon is 4-1 so far. That's one stat of Treon's that I prefer. I'm a big CL fan but comparing him and Treon is apples and oranges.

Leak apparently had a better line. He obviously was more experienced as a True Sophomore. He also didn't have the defense on the other side of him that Harris has (less room for Offensive error) and the East was better than it currently is. At the end of the day we should be happy that both are/were Gators.

 

[WobbleGator]

Nothing gets insults slung around more than talking about who the better QB is.

 

[TheDouglas78]

Nothing gets insults slung around more than talking about who the better QB is.

Wobble is a fan of Grady.

 

[ATXGator]

The stats are great, but does anybody think we are a better offense with Treon vs. Will? Treon has done a good job in the role he has been in, but you can see the difference in how Will reads the defense, went through his progressions and got the ball out fast. The other thing Will does that Treon doesn't do is throw a guy open. He gets the ball out while the receiver is in his break vs. Treon who waits for the guy to break and be open before throwing the ball.

That said... it doesn't really matter at this point. The NCAA Is not going to approve Will to play this year. Treon is our QB and I'm glad we have him. He has made plays, the throw to Calloway against UGA was a great throw, and he has contributed to our team winning 3 more games and winning the East. With our defense we do have a shot against Bama... we need some turnovers, but our defense will be the best that Bama has played. If we can stop Henry and put some pressure on them thorwing the ball and get some turnovers then you never know....

 

[Alagator]

We have a brand new offense this season. As such, one would expect the offense to improve over the course of the season.

Will Grier was a redshirt frosh, without the benefit of playing time last year, and was playing the first few games in a brand new offense. Treon has last years experience on his side, and has the benefit of starting the back end of the season with an offense that is gelling as the season progresses.

Anyone with eyes to see could tell that WG has a way higher upside. I'd expect that if he were still starting his stats would meet or exceed what Treon is doing as the continues to progress. That said, TH is who we have and he's playing his heart out. I'm glad he's a Gator.

 

[ufgator2002]

I've said all along if TH had WG height he could be just as good because he is a gamer. We have all seen what happens when the def is disciplined enough to keep him in the pocket, (and we know bama will) He struggles mightily throwing as he isn't tall enough to see over the line. For that reason if WG keeps progressing I would take him every time.

 

[Alagator]

Seems like dating all the way back to last year, when TH is in an obvious passing situation, he struggles mightily. He is at his best when we keep the defense guessing. (of course this can be said about any QB).

Also, opposing D's honoring his ability to run makes a difference. I know we can't afford to lose him but I think we're going to have to run a few QB draws every game...just enough to keep them guessing. TH is really good when we're mixing it up. But when we're playing from behind or HAVE to have a throw I just know in my stomach he's gonna throw a lot of incomplete passes...and he almost always does.

 

[NavetG8r]

Thomas makes valid points but there's no doubt in my mind who would be the better QB behind a competent OLine. Harris is best when he's forced to improvise. Our current situation at OLine affords him a great many opportunities to use his strengths.

 

[Durty South Swamp]

Throw all the stats you want out there but its really pretty simple. Treon's completion percentage hovers not far from 50%, and he doesnt throw a lot either putting the onerous on the line and rb's to get consistent yards on the ground. It's just not a great formula when your line is inexperienced, banged up, and you have struggled to run the ball. It wouldn't be as ugly if we could get consistent yards per carry but it's just not the case.

Defenses were playing the pass more against Grier b/c they knew he could hurt them if they didnt, they dont respect treon's throwing as much further compounding the problem. We seemed to run the ball a bit better with grier (safeties and LBs not up as close and playing pass more) because of it. Now they load the box.

Bottom line - if a qb isnt at least above 60% completion rate in a balanced offense, you are probably going to struggle and look ugly a decent amount of the time.

 

[aka]

Grier is a non-issue. Why do some of you continue to torture yourselves?

 

[stephenPE]

Grier is a non-issue. Why do some of you continue to torture yourselves?

eat up with dmazzz.......Chris Leak played under 3 different off co-ordinators. He was loyal and stayed a gator. He was a great kid
that never did stupid sh#t. He stayed healthy and played lights out in the biggest game none here will never smell. Timmy was a God
here. He made every white guy puff up and say "see what he can do in a game dominated by black athletes. He deserved every accolade
he got and more. He would make a winner out of many pro teams. He is a legend that deserves that status. Why fans of a team have to denigrate current of former players is such a mystery to me. Somehow it demonstrates some sort of football knowledge........I dont know. I just know it pisssses me off and I will
reply to some of it with a few expletives.......

 

[gatormandan]

All I can say is I am so glad Treon didnt transfer after losing the starting job. I have been somewhat critical of him at times but we have managed to win with him back there. I pray he continues to improve.

 

[oxrageous]

He was a great kid that never did stupid sh#t.

Evidently you never saw him slide 2 yards before the 1st down marker.

 

[GatorJ]

Evidently you never saw him slide 2 yards before the 1st down marker.

My God, that was so frustrating. He constantly pulled up in front of first down markers. I'll never forget the stadium going insane because Tim would pick up those first downs because Leak would not. Leak was constantly criticized because of that.