Which is exactly the kind of behavior you guys have been clamoring for, so it should make you happy.Just watched today's presser on Gatorvision, it conveniently cut that part but boy was Billy peeved. He was seething with anger towards the fans and reporters.
These next 3 pressers are going to be awesome! He's already going with the "prison Mike" look. Plus we already know he's violent as he supposedly attacked Dabo.
Im almost ready to put money down that he throws a water bottle at a reporter or pulls a Will Smith on a fan.
"Keep my players name out cho mouth!"
Which is exactly the kind of behavior you guys have been clamoring for, so it should make you happy.
All of you fellas misunderstand me, and have done so since day 1. If Billy was fired tomorrow it wouldn't bother me in the slightest. There are millions of red flags, baffling ones. How can someone who seems so process-based also seem to be so damn disorganized? I didn't know what to expect from Napier, but disorganized was one of those things I didn't expect.
However, there is something you all have to grasp, or you'll continue to take years off your life. Billy isn't getting fired anytime soon. It's not even something that is on the radar of the AD, the President, the Board, or the janitor (well, maybe the janitor). He'll have next year AT MINIMUM, and if the wheels fall off he'll get canned in the middle of his 4th season like all the others. The fact that AGAIN we all have to b!tch about firing a coach on this board for at least 18 months sucks balls.
I'm personally not going to wring my hands and spew hate for 18 months, I refuse.
And Billy isn't Muschamp, who was a major jerk (who couldn't recruit), or Butters, who was a major idiot (who couldn't recruit), or Mullen, who was an amazing combination of jerk and idiot (who couldn't recruit). He's a decent guy who works his ass off on the trail and it's paying off. He's fair game when it comes to his coaching, but the personal vitriol (like Silverback's insane post, or anything Gatorbait25 posts about him) is surprising even to me. There is plenty to criticize him about without making crap up.
The only control any of us have over any of this is not to care/watch anymore. We can just walk away. Millions have over the last 10 years. I don't think the current UF brass (including Sasse) really give a damn. They want to be an Ivy League school, that's what they dream about. Not winning titles.
Ox, this is a good post and the reference to the disorganization resonates strongly with me and I’m sure many other posters. It is in conflict with a guy who puts so much into reshaping the culture, facilities, support staffing, and recruiting. How can a coach who just got the big break all coaches are looking for, one that not only allows him to coach and compete at the highest level but also sets him and his family up financially for the foreseeable future, be seemingly so clueless and now defensive when those questioning him are really also telling him “Billy, you’re blowing it!?”All of you fellas misunderstand me, and have done so since day 1. If Billy was fired tomorrow it wouldn't bother me in the slightest. There are millions of red flags, baffling ones. How can someone who seems so process-based also seem to be so damn disorganized? I didn't know what to expect from Napier, but disorganized was one of those things I didn't expect.
However, there is something you all have to grasp, or you'll continue to take years off your life. Billy isn't getting fired anytime soon. It's not even something that is on the radar of the AD, the President, the Board, or the janitor (well, maybe the janitor). He'll have next year AT MINIMUM, and if the wheels fall off he'll get canned in the middle of his 4th season like all the others. The fact that AGAIN we all have to b!tch about firing a coach on this board for at least 18 months sucks balls.
Really a crappy point to be at, but as a lifelong fan, there’s no other option but to hang on and pull for a positive sudden change or the next reset to finally bring the prosperity and consistency we crave.The only control any of us have over any of this is not to care/watch anymore. We can just walk away. Millions have over the last 10 years. I don't think the current UF brass (including Sasse) really give a damn. They want to be an Ivy League school, that's what they dream about. Not winning titles.
Cover, if he's not getting it who is going to change his mind? His main issue, offense aside, is organizational. How many of his assistants need to improve their results? Can Billy replace inadequate coaches? Even if he did, are there changes in training and development(practice) that need to happen as well? From his pressers it seems that this is his foundation and he's going to stay with it regardless of the results.Ox, this is a good post and the reference to the disorganization resonates strongly with me and I’m sure many other posters. It is in conflict with a guy who puts so much into reshaping the culture, facilities, support staffing, and recruiting. How can a coach who just got the big break all coaches are looking for, one that not only allows him to coach and compete at the highest level but also sets him and his family up financially for the foreseeable future, be seemingly so clueless and now defensive when those questioning him are really also telling him “Billy, you’re blowing it!?”
Personally, I could choke down his middling offense and maybe even get over losses, knowing we are at a competitive talent deficit, but I cannot abide constant personnel mistakes, clock management and timeout errors, continuing poor technique, tackling, and alignment, but especially, especially the instances of lack of effort that is on display every game! I believe Billy wants to succeed and has put a lot of stock in building a “Saban Model” in terms of organizational structure to facilitate success. Where he is obviously falling short is in his role as CEO and providing the requisite oversight, guidance, and direction. There are also growing questions with Armstrong’s abilities along with other position coaches that include but aren’t limited to OL, DL, and the Secondary. Special Teams are almost at the Joe Biden level of gaffes. There’s a ton that must be fixed in order for this team to be consistently functional, much less more competitive, and getting defensive when your cavalcade of errors is spotlighted or doubling down on how invested the kids are don’t tell anyone really much more than “I don’t know what the F to do!”
I‘d like to say that Billy’s at a crossroads, but I’m not sure that he isn’t well beyond and heading toward the shti can, but regardless, he’s got to find a way to at least be competitive in these remaining games and more importantly accept that most of the errors are correctable with assignment of responsibility and his providing oversight and correction far beyond what we have seen to date. Can it be done at this point? It will be hard, but it’s doable. The bigger question is WILL it be done? Here’s where the doubt arises. The doubling down previously referenced is the sticker. Very frustrating to see a coach dig his heels in and keep doing the same unsuccessful things over and over while expecting different results. Commitment is often confused with pride and we should all know where an excess of the latter can lead.
Really a crappy point to be at, but as a lifelong fan, there’s no other option but to hang on and pull for a positive sudden change or the next reset to finally bring the prosperity and consistency we crave.
First, Cover, glad you are feeling well enough to be giving thoughtful posts. You also don't seem too drugged up - sorry about that part.the reference to the disorganization resonates strongly with me and I’m sure many other posters. It is in conflict with a guy who puts so much into reshaping the culture, facilities, support staffing, and recruiting. How can a coach who just got the big break all coaches are looking for, one that not only allows him to coach and compete at the highest level but also sets him and his family up financially for the foreseeable future, be seemingly so clueless and now defensive when those questioning him are really also telling him “Billy, you’re blowing it!?”
Ideally, the AD would have already pulled him aside and gone over the list of areas requiring change and required a plan and implementation to rectify. I don’t know many who have confidence in Stricklin to fill that role. But hoping for change is never a viable plan. Other than OL, DL, and Secondary coaches, I can’t tell you exactly who needs an @ss-chewing to dismissal, but looking at the totality of the product, there either needs to be some dead weight jettisoned or eventually the whole bunch will be gone.Cover, if he's not getting it who is going to change his mind? His main issue, offense aside, is organizational. How many of his assistants need to improve their results? Can Billy replace inadequate coaches? Even if he did, are there changes in training and development(practice) that need to happen as well? From his pressers it seems that this is his foundation and he's going to stay with it regardless of the results.
Is it possible to say what he specifically has to change? Yes, we need great players. But even with stellar recruiting, is that going to be enough? If we cannot tell what needs to happen, how would we know this off season if what needs to happen, did?
Agreed and to your point about overwhelming organizational size, if it’s too big to manage and get what you need from it, you’re wasting your time and hindering your actual ability to compete and succeed. I get the feeling Billy likes the idea of having this conglomerate, but hasn’t really got a grasp on what it takes to manage it so that it produces at peak efficiency.First, Cover, glad you are feeling well enough to be giving thoughtful posts. You also don't seem too drugged up - sorry about that part.
To this point you made, perhaps more than correcting the middling offense, these ineptitudes is where the OC vs CEO issue becomes most highlighted. While I don't disagree that the modern football staff can be VERY much a competitive advantage if organized correctly and functioning well ... but, if not managed well, a far smaller, 1990's staff is almost better for things like ST coaching. When the group is tighter, you manage less. When the entity/system is this large, the leader must lead, not be a subordinate department head. It takes too much time away from seeing the ST problems in advance. What "processes" did he have in place to know in advance if ST had a method of avoiding multiple of the same # on the field, a competent way to organize them pre-play (like every 3-5 man midget football coaching staff is capable) to ensure 11 (and only 11) on the field, etc. It would also allow him to be more directly in player personnel and their development.
Separately, I think his overall "strategy" to win doesn't meet the metrics he lauds. Plodding, needing perfection on each snap puts you in several tight games and leads to 3-5 losses a season. But, even if that could adjust or improve with an OC, the overall operation would be better if Billy wasn't having to spend so much of his own time planning his call sheets. Or, he doesn't spend enough time on that department head role, which is why our offense sucks (I think that is not the case and his offense/play calling philosophy just sucks, but can't really know what the alternative would look like).
Yes, and it is also not likely he has a list of better coaches available. Whereas, we believe a staff evaluates and puts the best players on the field, and eventually accept the others will transfer, some coaches do not have the same ability to replace their assistants.In reality, I think that if he was going to change things, we would have seen and heard by now. I’m not sure that his level of self-awareness is at a point that allows him to reflect and critically assess needed changes and then proceed to actually making the hard decisions that implementing changes require. Billy has shown that he doesn’t like getting his feelings hurt and those people usually have a problem hurting the feelings of others, but it is absolutely necessary in that profession.
@cover2 glad to see you up and posting. Hope all is going well for you.Ox, this is a good post and the reference to the disorganization resonates strongly with me and I’m sure many other posters. It is in conflict with a guy who puts so much into reshaping the culture, facilities, support staffing, and recruiting. How can a coach who just got the big break all coaches are looking for, one that not only allows him to coach and compete at the highest level but also sets him and his family up financially for the foreseeable future, be seemingly so clueless and now defensive when those questioning him are really also telling him “Billy, you’re blowing it!?”
Personally, I could choke down his middling offense and maybe even get over losses, knowing we are at a competitive talent deficit, but I cannot abide constant personnel mistakes, clock management and timeout errors, continuing poor technique, tackling, and alignment, but especially, especially the instances of lack of effort that is on display every game! I believe Billy wants to succeed and has put a lot of stock in building a “Saban Model” in terms of organizational structure to facilitate success. Where he is obviously falling short is in his role as CEO and providing the requisite oversight, guidance, and direction. There are also growing questions with Armstrong’s abilities along with other position coaches that include but aren’t limited to OL, DL, and the Secondary. Special Teams are almost at the Joe Biden level of gaffes. There’s a ton that must be fixed in order for this team to be consistently functional, much less more competitive, and getting defensive when your cavalcade of errors is spotlighted or doubling down on how invested the kids are don’t tell anyone really much more than “I don’t know what the F to do!”
I‘d like to say that Billy’s at a crossroads, but I’m not sure that he isn’t well beyond and heading toward the shti can, but regardless, he’s got to find a way to at least be competitive in these remaining games and more importantly accept that most of the errors are correctable with assignment of responsibility and his providing oversight and correction far beyond what we have seen to date. Can it be done at this point? It will be hard, but it’s doable. The bigger question is WILL it be done? Here’s where the doubt arises. The doubling down previously referenced is the sticker. Very frustrating to see a coach dig his heels in and keep doing the same unsuccessful things over and over while expecting different results. Commitment is often confused with pride and we should all know where an excess of the latter can lead.
Really a crappy point to be at, but as a lifelong fan, there’s no other option but to hang on and pull for a positive sudden change or the next reset to finally bring the prosperity and consistency we crave.
I agree on all of this... especially the part regarding the AD (and if Sasse were ever to get involved, it would be with the AD and board, not Billy).Ideally, the AD would have already pulled him aside and gone over the list of areas requiring change and required a plan and implementation to rectify. I don’t know many who have confidence in Stricklin to fill that role. But hoping for change is never a viable plan. Other than OL, DL, and Secondary coaches, I can’t tell you exactly who needs an @ss-chewing to dismissal, but looking at the totality of the product, there either needs to be some dead weight jettisoned or eventually the whole bunch will be gone.
Billy is obviously dug in. We’ve all seen coaches cling tightly to THEIR plan come hell or high water. It’s a pride thing and usually precedes a fall. Being afraid to admit your failures and make necessary changes is pretty much a death sentence. The underlying theme seems to be that Billy can recruit his way out of the current morass. I think he can improve talent and athleticism but if he continues with the same blueprint there’s no reason to expect much more than we’re seeing now. Everybody on our schedule knows that if they play their game and minimize their miscues, Billy will ultimately step on his dick or poor effort/technique will provide an opportunity for another Gator collapse.
In reality, I think that if he was going to change things, we would have seen and heard by now. I’m not sure that his level of self-awareness is at a point that allows him to reflect and critically assess needed changes and then proceed to actually making the hard decisions that implementing changes require. Billy has shown that he doesn’t like getting his feelings hurt and those people usually have a problem hurting the feelings of others, but it is absolutely necessary in that profession.
I agree on all of this... especially the part regarding the AD (and if Sasse were ever to get involved, it would be with the AD and board, not Billy).
What we really don't know (unless someone has the full language of it) is how much absolute control Stricklin gave Billy in his contract, because at the time of signing, it sounded like Billy demanded pretty much absolute control over the process. Doesn't mean you can't fire him, but would probably mean that unless you have cause, he'd probably get every penny of his contract.
Agreed, my point is that it may be very likely that the AD has exactly ZERO leverage other than to tell Billy, "We're firing you if you don't do the following, but you'll get all your money" even if Stricklin wanted to sack up this time on fighting terms/dollars. Paying McElwain everything should've gotten someone fired (but again, would have to know what contract said and if we thought the cost of legal fight was going to be favorable).... what a mess.We gave McElwain all of his contract, even after publicly alleging that UF fans were threatening to kill him and his family, just weeks removed from a credit card scandal involving half his team. And we were twice as desperate in ‘21. There is zero chance Napier is not getting all of his contract if he is ever terminated.
Agreed, my point is that it may be very likely that the AD has exactly ZERO leverage other than to tell Billy, "We're firing you if you don't do the following, but you'll get all your money" even if Stricklin wanted to sack up this time on fighting terms/dollars. Paying McElwain everything should've gotten someone fired (but again, would have to know what contract said and if we thought the cost of legal fight was going to be favorable).... what a mess.
I feel like our last few hirings have gone much like this...I just don’t think Strickland has the stomach for a fight. If you remember, McElwain actually paid some of his CSU buy out out of his own pocket. Probably should’ve been a red flag there, but that’s a separate issue. But if he wasn’t able to get us to cover all of his former employer’s buyout, I’d be shocked if the language was airtight on him getting the full boat. We just have a TGIFriday’s front of house manager running the athletic department and caved due to weakness.
I'm personally not going to wring my hands and spew hate for 18 months, I refuse.
He's fair game when it comes to his coaching, but the personal vitriol (like Silverback's insane post, or anything Gatorbait25 posts about him) is surprising even to me. There is plenty to criticize him about without making crap up.
Agreed, my point is that it may be very likely that the AD has exactly ZERO leverage other than to tell Billy, "We're firing you if you don't do the following, but you'll get all your money" even if Stricklin wanted to sack up this time on fighting terms/dollars. Paying McElwain everything should've gotten someone fired (but again, would have to know what contract said and if we thought the cost of legal fight was going to be favorable).... what a mess.
Typically, buyouts are paid because the coach knows where the skeletons are. Which boosters were paying under the table, what the University "knew" about, etc. This is a lot less relevant in the NIL era since most of the players can be paid legally; so I expect schools to have a lot more leverage in the future when it comes to reduced payouts.
As you said, we don't know what the contract language specifies, but I'm sure the coach isn't squeaky clean if the University wants to approach it from that angle. Really, this shouldn't be too difficult: get the coach and his agent or lawyer to sit down and say "look, this isn't working and we need to make a change. We could do this the hard way and find 'for cause' reasons to cite, or we can just come to a number. As of today, you're technically owed $36M. We can make it messy and contested to reduce that, but let's avoid a mudfight and you tell us what you're willing to live with."
If they paid Mulligan the full BO, they are paying Napier. FTR, I don't think firing should be on the table. But his acting like losses are okay and probably behind the scene refusing to make large changes to his process could make that inevitable. To me, he should be taking losses badly and intimating, at least, that they know what the issues are and will be addressed asap. Recruits and commits are watching and listening.Maybe.
But if Billy is clean the reply will be pound sand and pay me the $36M.