We Talkin Bout The State of the Program!

[MJMGator]

Since we

LOL. The question does NOT stand alone. Let's make this simple. DO we want an empty chair or another kid filling the spot? Sure, we'll take another breathing body. Done and done.

Now, let's get under the hood and look at what is underneath any decision to take ANOTHER grad transfer at the QB position. Peter pan actually made a great point...it's another arm taking away reps from Frask slowing their development. And God forbid this guy beats everyone out...I didn't want LDR starting and I don't want a guy who has two blown achilles heels starting either. Year 3 - let's roll with FRASK. I am willing to give these guys a shot and see where Mac can finally be the QB whisperer.

I have several unoccupied bedrooms so I guess I should start taking in homeless folk.

 

[T REX]

Since we

I have several unoccupied bedrooms so I guess I should start taking in homeless folk.

Not at all but for argument's sake I will concede that point to make mine. We shouldn't just take anyone. If he's here to actually compete then I am really worried about Frask.

 

[Swamp Donkey]

No way the 116th ranked offense is an "arsenal".

LOL. He saw "improvement".

Year 3 - let's roll with FRASK. I am willing to give these guys a shot and see where Mac can finally be the QB whisperer.

That's a terrible idea but probably what we are stuck with regardless. It's also inevitable that 2222 and his ilk will see improvement no matter how poorly we play and how many losses we rack up (as a result of devastating injuries which no coach could overcome).

 

[GatorTAG]

That doesn't answer the question. The question was how could it be a negative for Sirk to use one of our vacant scholarships.

I'm just curious how you are seeing the addition of a talented player to the roster as a negative.

The question is, if this guy's is so talented why isn't Duke doing everything in their power to keep him. If he's setting school records why isn't he already designated their starter next year? I think once you answer those questions you'll figure out why we should be apprehensive.

 

[GatorTAG]

Let's continue down this path of thinking Sirk is so talented we should bring him here. Let's suppose he's as good as you say and he wins the starting job and plays all of 2017.

2018 who's our starter? We're back to having to find a starter in a roster of QB's with no game experience. How does that better our program?

Do we just keep bringing in grad transfers every year?

How does that speak to the ability of our coaches to recruit and develop a QB? Which is really the question we're all waiting to have answered.

 

[GatorSkin]

As a redshirt freshman at Duke in 2013 Thomas Sirk suffered a ruptured right achilles injury and missed the entire season.

In 2014 the sophomore was the backup QB and was used in short yardage packages as a runner. He led the team with 8 rushing TDs.

In 2015 Sirk was the starting QB. He threw for 2,625 yards, 16 touchdowns and eight interceptions. He also led the team with 803 rushing yards with 8 TDs.

In February 2016 he suffered a ruptured left achilles injury. Then he reinjured it just before the start of the season and missed all of the 2016 season.

Sirk holds the Duke records in most consecutive passes without an interception, most offensive plays in a season, most rushing yards and TDs in a bowl game, and more. He’s also Top 5 in program history in rushing TDs, 100+ rushing yard games for a QB, and winning percentage. He led the Blue Devils to their first bowl victory since 1961 earning Co-MVP honors in the 2015 Pinstripe Bowl after leading a Duke comeback and overtime win.

The 6'4" 220 pound QB was a preseason candidate for the Maxwell Award, Manning Award, Johnny Unitas Golden Arm Award and Davey O’Brien Award in 2016. In 24 career games (12 starts) he has completed 261-of-441 (.592) passes for 2,692 yards with 19 TDs and eight INTs while rushing 210 times for 1,041 yards (4.96) and 16 TDs. For his career at Duke he was sacked a total of 12 times, good for a sack-to-pass attempt ratio of 1:36.75. He lost a total of 2 fumbles in 999 career snaps.

Sirk compiled 300+ yards of total offense in six career games including a personal-high of 401 (315 pass & 86 rush) against N.C. Central in 2015. He has accounted for multiple TDs in 10 career games including a personal-high four scores against both N.C. Central (2015; 3 pass & 1 rush) and Virginia Tech (2015; 4 pass).

He is one of three players in ACC history to record 800+ rushing yards and 2,500+ passing yards in a single season, joining Clemson’s Deshaun Watson and North Carolina’s Marquise Williams as all three QBs accomplished the feat during the 2015 campaign.

I hope he becomes a Gator. It certainly couldn't hurt to have him use one of our vacant scholarships.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/duke-qb-thomas-sirk-to-pursue-graduate-transfer-165806054.html
https://balldurham.com/2017/03/01/duke-quarterback-thomas-sirk-announces-decision-transfer/
http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22672&SPID=1843&ATCLID=205459563&DB_OEM_ID=4200

I stopped reading after the second Achilles injury I'm sure it was a cool story though thanks for sharing.

 

[Fishon]

I get having another dude for depth, but at this point we need to go with who we have as the potential starters. Ride or die with your guys

 

[GatorJ]

As a redshirt freshman at Duke in 2013 Thomas Sirk suffered a ruptured right achilles injury and missed the entire season.

In 2014 the sophomore was the backup QB and was used in short yardage packages as a runner. He led the team with 8 rushing TDs.

In 2015 Sirk was the starting QB. He threw for 2,625 yards, 16 touchdowns and eight interceptions. He also led the team with 803 rushing yards with 8 TDs.

In February 2016 he suffered a ruptured left achilles injury. Then he reinjured it just before the start of the season and missed all of the 2016 season.

Sirk holds the Duke records in most consecutive passes without an interception, most offensive plays in a season, most rushing yards and TDs in a bowl game, and more. He’s also Top 5 in program history in rushing TDs, 100+ rushing yard games for a QB, and winning percentage. He led the Blue Devils to their first bowl victory since 1961 earning Co-MVP honors in the 2015 Pinstripe Bowl after leading a Duke comeback and overtime win.

The 6'4" 220 pound QB was a preseason candidate for the Maxwell Award, Manning Award, Johnny Unitas Golden Arm Award and Davey O’Brien Award in 2016. In 24 career games (12 starts) he has completed 261-of-441 (.592) passes for 2,692 yards with 19 TDs and eight INTs while rushing 210 times for 1,041 yards (4.96) and 16 TDs. For his career at Duke he was sacked a total of 12 times, good for a sack-to-pass attempt ratio of 1:36.75. He lost a total of 2 fumbles in 999 career snaps.

Sirk compiled 300+ yards of total offense in six career games including a personal-high of 401 (315 pass & 86 rush) against N.C. Central in 2015. He has accounted for multiple TDs in 10 career games including a personal-high four scores against both N.C. Central (2015; 3 pass & 1 rush) and Virginia Tech (2015; 4 pass).

He is one of three players in ACC history to record 800+ rushing yards and 2,500+ passing yards in a single season, joining Clemson’s Deshaun Watson and North Carolina’s Marquise Williams as all three QBs accomplished the feat during the 2015 campaign.

I hope he becomes a Gator. It certainly couldn't hurt to have him use one of our vacant scholarships.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/duke-qb-thomas-sirk-to-pursue-graduate-transfer-165806054.html
https://balldurham.com/2017/03/01/duke-quarterback-thomas-sirk-announces-decision-transfer/
http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22672&SPID=1843&ATCLID=205459563&DB_OEM_ID=4200

What if I were to tell you the following story?

He was the top recruit in the country at an imposing 6'4" and 231 pounds. With blazing speed and a rocket arm.

As a true sophomore he he endured a brutal training camp battle with the #3 ranked dual-threat quarterback in the nation and took the reigns of a top program and led them to an 11-2 record and on the brink of playing for the national championship. During this remarkable sophomore campaign he set the all-time mark for rushing yards by a quarterback by rushing for 177 yards in a game. Surpassing the all-time record one of the greatest quarterbacks to ever play the game.

As a junior he started the year on a tear by completing 70% of his passes but then suffered a horrible injury at the beginning of the season and missed the rest of the year and received a medical redshirt.

As a redshirt junior he struggled with consistency following the injury plagued year and eventually lost his position as a starter.

Needing a fresh start, he transferred his senior year and responded with one of the top QB stat lines by throwing for a remarkable 4000 yards, 27 TDs, and 8 INTs leading to him getting drafted by the NFL.

See? Playing with data and information can be fun. You can manipulate it anyway you want.

By the way, in case you didn't figure it out, that was Driskel...

 

[Durty South Swamp]

They do it because winning to them is more important than taking care of their students. So if being a football factory and winning are your priorities then do whatever you can get away with, if you have priorities that include academics, developing all our athletes as individuals for the benefit then you do different things. Now I understand that the NCAA is under some pressure to require full ride schollys.

Now it is fine for you to have a different view than I do, just not fine to insist I am wrong.

Dont flatter yourself. You are wrong, but it has nothing to do with the moral argument you are bringing up. That isn't in debate. Ive already stated in this thread I don't think the practice is morally or ethically legit, but that it is en vogue regardless and we can either pat each other on the back while we continue to get our butts kicked or we can get on board. No bro, what you are wrong about is your insistence on the fallacy that if we engage in this practice it will make it harder for us to recruit. That's just flat out wrong, and all the schools doing it who out recruit us every year prove it. Time to move on...

 

[ChiefGator]

Dont flatter yourself. You are wrong, but it has nothing to do with the moral argument you are bringing up. That isn't in debate. Ive already stated in this thread I don't think the practice is morally or ethically legit, but that it is en vogue regardless and we can either pat each other on the back while we continue to get our butts kicked or we can get on board. No bro, what you are wrong about is your insistence on the fallacy that if we engage in this practice it will make it harder for us to recruit. That's just flat out wrong, and all the schools doing it who out recruit us every year prove it. Time to move on...

Past time to move on and when the NCAA or the courts require such well you know. And of course I value my school over being harder to recruit any day of the week and some days twice. And of course I insist I am not wrong either, I might not be right.

 

[GatorJ]

Past time to move on and when the NCAA or the courts require such well you know. And of course I value my school over being harder to recruit any day of the week and some days twice. And of course I insist I am not wrong either, I might not be right.

 

[Gator2222]

Since we

I have several unoccupied bedrooms so I guess I should start taking in homeless folk.

Careful with that statement, there are lot of liberals in Gainesville that want to make that a reality.

 

[Gator2222]

Not at all but for argument's sake I will concede that point to make mine. We shouldn't just take anyone. If he's here to actually compete then I am really worried about Frask.

I understand your point of view. In my opinion more competition is rarely ever a bad thing.

Remember back when Bowden was finishing in the top 5 every year for what seemed like a lifetime? Between 1987 and 2000 they never lost more than 2 games in any single season and finished in the top 5 every year. I hate FSU with a burning passion, but it was impressive. The FSU QBs during that streak were:

1987 McManus Sr
1988 Ferguson Sr
1989 Willis RSr
1990 Weldon Jr
1991 Weldon Sr
1992 Ward Jr
1993 Ward Sr
1994 Kanell Jr
1995 Kanell Sr
1996 Busby RJr
1997 Busby RSr
1998 Weinke So
1999 Weinke Jr
2000 Weinke Sr

Then the streak was broken with:

2001 Rix RFr

The point being that if we bring in an experienced QB that manages to honestly win the job, that doesn't mean that Trask and Franks are bad QB's. It is rarely ever desirable to start a freshman or redshirt freshman QB in big time football. That streak was due to many factors, but it's not a coincidence that they always had a junior or senior QB (with the exception of 1998).

Mac walked into a situation where there was literally no depth at QB. He had to grab whatever transfers he could get just to field a team. He is building that QB depth, but you can't get upper classmen at a position instantly unless you get transfers or JUCO players.

Best case scenario is that one of the youngsters steps up and hits a homerun. I greatly prefer that to happen. However, if they need another year to develop, it couldn't hurt to have Sirk on hand.

 

[Gator2222]

The question is, if this guy's is so talented why isn't Duke doing everything in their power to keep him. If he's setting school records why isn't he already designated their starter next year? I think once you answer those questions you'll figure out why we should be apprehensive.

When Sirk got hurt Daniel Jones stepped up and took over. The coaching staff decided to go with one talented player over another. That doesn't mean that Sirk is a bad QB. Eric Kresser was one of the best QB's in the country and he couldn't get on the field because Wuerffel was in front of him. Kresser transferred to Marshall for his senior season and won the national championship. I'm not saying Sirk is Kresser. I'm just saying that it's entirely possible to have two very good QB's at the same time.

 

[Gator2222]

What if I were to tell you the following story?

He was the top recruit in the country at an imposing 6'4" and 231 pounds. With blazing speed and a rocket arm.

As a true sophomore he he endured a brutal training camp battle with the #3 ranked dual-threat quarterback in the nation and took the reigns of a top program and led them to an 11-2 record and on the brink of playing for the national championship. During this remarkable sophomore campaign he set the all-time mark for rushing yards by a quarterback by rushing for 177 yards in a game. Surpassing the all-time record one of the greatest quarterbacks to ever play the game.

As a junior he started the year on a tear by completing 70% of his passes but then suffered a horrible injury at the beginning of the season and missed the rest of the year and received a medical redshirt.

As a redshirt junior he struggled with consistency following the injury plagued year and eventually lost his position as a starter.

Needing a fresh start, he transferred his senior year and responded with one of the top QB stat lines by throwing for a remarkable 4000 yards, 27 TDs, and 8 INTs leading to him getting drafted by the NFL.

See? Playing with data and information can be fun. You can manipulate it anyway you want.

By the way, in case you didn't figure it out, that was Driskel...

I simply copied and pasted all of that information from the sites listed at the bottom of my post. When I saw the info on this board that Sirk might become a Gator, I honestly had no idea who he was. Never heard of him since I don't follow Duke football. I looked him up and posted the info in case there were others that had never heard of him. I wasn't manipulating anything. I simply posted a timeline of Sirk at Duke with stats and references.

By the way, I honestly think Driskel could have been a good QB at Florida if he had played for a coach like Spurrier instead of a coach that despised offense.

 

[T REX]

I understand your point of view. In my opinion more competition is rarely ever a bad thing.

Remember back when Bowden was finishing in the top 5 every year for what seemed like a lifetime? Between 1987 and 2000 they never lost more than 2 games in any single season and finished in the top 5 every year. I hate FSU with a burning passion, but it was impressive. The FSU QBs during that streak were:

1987 McManus Sr
1988 Ferguson Sr
1989 Willis RSr
1990 Weldon Jr
1991 Weldon Sr
1992 Ward Jr
1993 Ward Sr
1994 Kanell Jr
1995 Kanell Sr
1996 Busby RJr
1997 Busby RSr
1998 Weinke So
1999 Weinke Jr
2000 Weinke Sr

Then the streak was broken with:

2001 Rix RFr

The point being that if we bring in an experienced QB that manages to honestly win the job, that doesn't mean that Trask and Franks are bad QB's. It is rarely ever desirable to start a freshman or redshirt freshman QB in big time football. That streak was due to many factors, but it's not a coincidence that they always had a junior or senior QB (with the exception of 1998).

Mac walked into a situation where there was literally no depth at QB. He had to grab whatever transfers he could get just to field a team. He is building that QB depth, but you can't get upper classmen at a position instantly unless you get transfers or JUCO players.

Best case scenario is that one of the youngsters steps up and hits a homerun. I greatly prefer that to happen. However, if they need another year to develop, it couldn't hurt to have Sirk on hand.

LOL. You are talking about a million years ago. The dynamics of football have completely changed bud. Not buying what you are selling. It's year 3 and time for you to stop making excuses. You need to start holding the staff accountable. I don't think you've posted one critical thing of this staff.

That was a poor post for you. I expect better.

 

[Durty South Swamp]

By the way, I honestly think Driskel could have been a good QB at Florida if he had played for a coach like Spurrier instead of a coach that despised offense.

Driskel would have never sniffed the field under spurrier. Good lord

 

[GatorTAG]

When Sirk got hurt Daniel Jones stepped up and took over. The coaching staff decided to go with one talented player over another. That doesn't mean that Sirk is a bad QB. Eric Kresser was one of the best QB's in the country and he couldn't get on the field because Wuerffel was in front of him. Kresser transferred to Marshall for his senior season and won the national championship. I'm not saying Sirk is Kresser. I'm just saying that it's entirely possible to have two very good QB's at the same time.

So the only reason Sirk is not going back to Duke is because Jones is a Heisman trophy candidate.

And if Sirk comes here we'll win a national championship. Okay, got it!

Who knew Duke was QB U?

 

[Gator2222]

So the only reason Sirk is not going back to Duke is because Jones is a Heisman trophy candidate.

And if Sirk comes here we'll win a national championship. Okay, got it!

Who knew Duke was QB U?

That's exactly what I said. Good grief.

 

[Durty South Swamp]

So the only reason Sirk is not going back to Duke is because Jones is a Heisman trophy candidate.

And if Sirk comes here we'll win a national championship. Okay, got it!

And who knew Duke was QB U?

its funny when he throws out these once a generation situations, then caveats them by saying "now I'm not saying this situation is that one..."

Well what the hell ARE you saying then?