Recruiting 2023 Recruiting Thread: 4* OT Caden Jones completes the class

[soflagator]

I used to think like that too but I’ve changed my tune over the years. Coaches can leave anytime they want for a better opportunity so should the kids. They have 4-5 years to play college football and the rest of their life to do something else not nearly as exciting. Go make the best of it. Later on in life when you have a real job you can up and leave for a better opportunity…everyone else gets to but college athletes…makes no sense

I don’t disagree entirely, and do think there are circumstances that should come in to play. Like you, I used to be firmly against it and thought it would really damage programs. I haven’t seen that so far.

But one thing that’s interesting is that it is now shifting in terms of benefit in favor of schools and coaches, not players. From what I read, there are apparently over 2300 players currently in the portal. Based on the data, roughly 46% or never signed to another program. So that means they are effectively ending their college careers by doing so. No other program to get exposure, no degree. From a stable full ride(most schools didn’t process) to an education, to now having nothing. And because programs are subject to being hurt, and coaches salaries are what they are, now schools everywhere are encouraging(pushing) kids out because they have to. So for every Jared Verse, there are hundreds of bad decisions that completely bite the player. And there will be roster upgrades like we’re likely seeing here, where a 3* kid is playing their last year of college football, because they were encouraged to leave to make room for an upgrade, and weren’t picked up. As always, when we try to make things “fair”, it ends up backfiring and plenty of kids from humble beginnings are now left out in the cold, which is exactly what I said would happen. Probably should’ve left in the way it was in retrospect, but we seemingly can’t help ourselves.

 

[lagator]

JUCO DL. Probably to SCe. But he's visiting.

Sounds good. Who is it?

 

[jdh5484]

Sounds good. Who is it?

Elijah Davis, a 6-foot-4, 300-pound sophomore from East Mississippi Community College.

 

[soflagator]

Elijah Davis, a 6-foot-4, 300-pound sophomore from East Mississippi Community College.

Honest question, when was the last time we had a good JuCo player? Not sure we’re not taking RFN in 2005. Actually not even sure I’ve heard of other teams really benefiting from them either. Seems like the portal is the new solution, not going JuCo.

 

[jdh5484]

Honest question, when was the last time we had a good JuCo player? Not sure we’re not taking RFN in 2005. Actually not even sure I’ve heard of other teams really benefiting from them either. Seems like the portal is the new solution, not going JuCo.

Thai Chiaokhiao-Bowman - 2022 - 2 nd WR, plays special teams. Adds depth. Plus gets extra scrabble points for the name.

I did some quick research and found this - 2014. Seems like I remember another DL or OL but I've lost interest in researching.

Big Uglies from CC bring instant depth. Maybe the portal is better, but Bamma also.offered the guy.

 

[CGgater]

I don’t disagree entirely, and do think there are circumstances that should come in to play. Like you, I used to be firmly against it and thought it would really damage programs. I haven’t seen that so far.

But one thing that’s interesting is that it is now shifting in terms of benefit in favor of schools and coaches, not players. From what I read, there are apparently over 2300 players currently in the portal. Based on the data, roughly 46% or never signed to another program. So that means they are effectively ending their college careers by doing so. No other program to get exposure, no degree. From a stable full ride(most schools didn’t process) to an education, to now having nothing. And because programs are subject to being hurt, and coaches salaries are what they are, now schools everywhere are encouraging(pushing) kids out because they have to. So for every Jared Verse, there are hundreds of bad decisions that completely bite the player. And there will be roster upgrades like we’re likely seeing here, where a 3* kid is playing their last year of college football, because they were encouraged to leave to make room for an upgrade, and weren’t picked up. As always, when we try to make things “fair”, it ends up backfiring and plenty of kids from humble beginnings are now left out in the cold, which is exactly what I said would happen. Probably should’ve left in the way it was in retrospect, but we seemingly can’t help ourselves.

I never predicted this type of fallout, but my objection was based on the “exploitation of amateur athletes” bs.

Free tuition and books.
Free room and board.
Free S&C and nutrition support staffs.
Free medical, including major surgery.
Free other stuff…

Meanwhile, the schools “raking in millions” have to redirect a large portion towards non-revenue sports, upgrade facilities, spend on coaches’ recruiting travel, away game travel, and on and on.

Even for those who won’t end up with a lucrative pro career, they get a lot of bennies with a full ride scholarship without the financial liabilities that are handled by the school, boosters, etc.

 

[NOLAGATOR]

I never predicted this type of fallout, but my objection was based on the “exploitation of amateur athletes” bs.

Free tuition and books.
Free room and board.
Free S&C and nutrition support staffs.
Free medical, including major surgery.
Free other stuff…

Meanwhile, the schools “raking in millions” have to redirect a large portion towards non-revenue sports, upgrade facilities, spend on coaches’ recruiting travel, away game travel, and on and on.

Even for those who won’t end up with a lucrative pro career, they get a lot of bennies with a full ride scholarship without the financial liabilities that are handled by the school, boosters, etc.

IMHO, NIL is meant as an incentive like a Grad Assistantship. Enough to live on but not lucrative.

 

[MJMGator]

I never predicted this type of fallout, but my objection was based on the “exploitation of amateur athletes” bs.

Free tuition and books.
Free room and board.
Free S&C and nutrition support staffs.
Free medical, including major surgery.
Free other stuff…

Meanwhile, the schools “raking in millions” have to redirect a large portion towards non-revenue sports, upgrade facilities, spend on coaches’ recruiting travel, away game travel, and on and on.

Even for those who won’t end up with a lucrative pro career, they get a lot of bennies with a full ride scholarship without the financial liabilities that are handled by the school, boosters, etc.

I used to think that way until these massive TV contracts had teams raking in $25-50m a year. The member institutions of these conferences got greedy and turned it into a huge business. Then, they allowed the NCAA to keep their head in the sand in regards to NIL and put it into the courts hands by their inaction. This is what we got. Don’t blame the players. Blame the schools of the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, ACC and PAC.

 

[soflagator]

I never predicted this type of fallout, but my objection was based on the “exploitation of amateur athletes” bs.

Free tuition and books.
Free room and board.
Free S&C and nutrition support staffs.
Free medical, including major surgery.
Free other stuff…

Meanwhile, the schools “raking in millions” have to redirect a large portion towards non-revenue sports, upgrade facilities, spend on coaches’ recruiting travel, away game travel, and on and on.

Even for those who won’t end up with a lucrative pro career, they get a lot of bennies with a full ride scholarship without the financial liabilities that are handled by the school, boosters, etc.

Fully agree on all those points. My go to phrase was for every Tim Tebow or Percy Harvin, who made a fortune for their school, there were three dozen Justin Williams types that got 5 years of education, food/housing, and growing up with some structure into adulthood, never once living up to their billing and ultimately being a net drain on the program.

In today’s environment, Williams is likely one of those kids who enters the portal and never comes out. That’s the difference between having a graduate degree free of charge and having no degree at all or an undergrad only with 100k in debt attached.

 

[AuggieDosta]

I used to think that way until these massive TV contracts had teams raking in $25-50m a year. The member institutions of these conferences got greedy and turned it into a huge business. Then, they allowed the NCAA to keep their head in the sand in regards to NIL and put it into the courts hands by their inaction. This is what we got. Don’t blame the players. Blame the schools of the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, ACC and PAC.

So your one of those types, that think all proceeds should be split evenly even though the House spends all the money to start the business AND takes all the risk?

 

[MJMGator]

So your one of those types, that think all proceeds should be split evenly even though the House spends all the money to start the business AND takes all the risk?

I don’t think you understand NIL. The players didn’t ask for a share of the schools’ profits. They just wanted to be able to earn something for their own name, image or likeness. The NCAA refused to even discuss it. They fuched themselves.

 

[AuggieDosta]

I don’t think you understand NIL. The players didn’t ask for a share of the schools’ profits. They just wanted to be able to earn something for their own name, image or likeness. The NCAA refused to even discuss it. They fuched themselves.

I don't think you understand why NIL started. And they absolutely did expect to cut into a schools profit. Not every school has a UAA.
Players, and NIL proposers, used the giant sums that conferences and schools were getting (of which, you also referenced) as their pie and said that because it was the players actions on the field, it was them that deserved to get a slice of the pie. IIRC some players even sued their school in order to get their slice.
And things like Xbox NCAA and jersey sales made it more convoluted.

 

[soflagator]

I don’t think you understand NIL. The players didn’t ask for a share of the schools’ profits. They just wanted to be able to earn something for their own name, image or likeness. The NCAA refused to even discuss it. They fuched themselves.

I hate the NCAA as much as anyone. But what they did, or tried to do, whether it hurt them long run or not, was not allow the pay for play we’re seeing right now. Kids being lured by contracts and places like A&M landing(buying) 20 of the top 100 players is what would inevitably become of it, and it took all of about 2 weeks to happen.

 

[NOLAGATOR]

NCAA needs to go.

We need Football, Baseball and Basketball Commissioners for P5. I'd have a rep from each conference and a Commissioner.

 

[MJMGator]

I hate the NCAA as much as anyone. But what they did, or tried to do, whether it hurt them long run or not, was not allow the pay for play we’re seeing right now. Kids being lured by contracts and places like A&M landing(buying) 20 of the top 100 players is what would inevitably become of it, and it took all of about 2 weeks to happen.

I don’t like it either, but I believe had the NCAA and it’s member institutions addressed it then they would still be able to regulate it. Because they chose not to, this is the result. Players couldn’t get sell their own autographs for crying out loud. Meanwhile, schools were raking in tens of millions annually from 2 sports…football and basketball. It was pure stupidity on the NCAA’s behalf.

 

[soflagator]

NCAA needs to go.

We need Football, Baseball and Basketball Commissioners for P5. I'd have a rep from each conference and a Commissioner.

The NCAA’s football regulatory office is in a strip mall between Winn Dixie and a Chinese place. They’re completely moot within cfb at this point.

 

[soflagator]

I don’t like it either, but I believe had the NCAA and it’s member institutions addressed it then they would still be able to regulate it. Because they chose not to, this is the result. Players couldn’t get sell their own autographs for crying out loud. Meanwhile, schools were raking in tens of millions annually from 2 sports…football and basketball. It was pure stupidity on the NCAA’s behalf.

Again, I can agree with that to an extent. I’ve just yet to see any scenario where it can’t be woven into recruiting. Despise them or not, corrupt or not, that’s what they were trying to prevent. I don’t think if this discussion was had in 1990, 2000, or 2010 it would be any different. You can’t allow players to make money off of their NIL without it being immediately turned into pay for play.

 

[CGgater]

I used to think that way until these massive TV contracts had teams raking in $25-50m a year. The member institutions of these conferences got greedy and turned it into a huge business. Then, they allowed the NCAA to keep their head in the sand in regards to NIL and put it into the courts hands by their inaction. This is what we got. Don’t blame the players. Blame the schools of the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, ACC and PAC.

So, we’ve been complaining for years about the millions in facility upgrades for almost every sport EXCEPT football, but the schools are greedy? I’m not saying there isn’t some greed involved, I just think more revenue is reinvested than some suggest. There’s also a certain level of entrepreneurship risk involved. Do the kids see a scholarship reduction if fan attendance and jersey sales plummet because they suck? They risk their bodies on the field, but they aren’t on the hook financially if sports programs tank.

And while the perception (real or imagined, I can’t prove it either way) of the greed may have contributed, it was Northwestern players who took action. So, it WAS the players after all.

 

[MJMGator]

Again, I can agree with that too and extent. I’ve just yet to see any scenario where it can’t be woven into recruiting. Despise them or not, corrupt or not, that’s what they were trying to prevent. I don’t think if this discussion was had in 1990, 2000, or 2010 it would be any different. You can’t allow players to make money off of their NIL without it being immediately turned into pay for play.

Sure they could have. They could have put a monetary limit on it to retain amateur status. They put limits on damn near everything the student athletes can do. They just preferred to keep looking out the window with headphones on.

 

[soflagator]

Sure they could have. They could have put a monetary limit on it to retain amateur status. They put limits on damn near everything the student athletes can do. They just preferred to keep looking out the window with headphones on.

But do you really think we would be having the same conversation in a few years, when the “schools and athletic departments aren’t limited on how much money they can make, so this isn’t fair” argument’s started?

Love the analogy, btw.