Grier transfers to WVU

[Oklahoma Gator]

I don't really see how anyone could disagree with what Law has to say here. 8 or 9 wins is no great feat . The East is really no better than the ACC, mid tier Big 10 or any other conference any more. We SHOULD cruise to another East title and IMO we are in troubled waters if we don't. We made excuses left and right for Muschamp during most of his time here because of the way Meyer left and look what it got us....The truth is good coaches/recruiters turn programs around sooner than later. Meyer, SOS, Saban, all had their teams competing for titles within 2 or 3 years. In fact Saban and Meyer have done it twice. Harbaugh has Michigan back to Top 10 status after 1 year. Hell even Jimbo had the Noles winning 10 plus games, winning conference titles, and in general has had them in the top 10 every year since his second.....Why don't we deserve that much if not more?

I just feel like so much if this sentiment is a reaction to how the last half of this year played out. The fact is that because of WG's dumb decisions we went from the best QB we've had since Tebow to the worst QB in the country and that halted a lot of momentum on and off the field. Mac and Nuss were sceaming guys open all over the field but Jamis light couldn't find them cause he was too busy smoking reefer. I have hope for the future because I think this offense can be effective now that the numbers on the line are fixed and we will probably never have QB play as bad as we did with Treon.

 

[T REX]

You should really try reading a whole thread before interjecting you're pre conceived misconception. Please go back and reread every post of mine in this thread and see if you still come to the conclusion that I'm making excuses. If so I'd recommend a 3rd grade reading comprehension course to bring you up to speed. See Rex, the days of just being a "pumper" or "gloomer" for sake of starting an argument are done. See if you can actually add something constructive for a change....

More insults I see...just status quo. Sorry...gotta go check out Green Eggs and Ham. Later!

 

[Alagator]

More insults I see...just status quo. Sorry...gotta go check out Green Eggs and Ham. Later!

 

[Concrete Helmet]

I have hope for the future because I think this offense can be effective now that the numbers on the line are fixed and we will probably never have QB play as bad as we did with Treon

I agree with this. I think Mac is a good offensive coach and if he finds even an average QB we should have a better than average team and win 10 or more games. I am truly worried about finding that QB though. I'm also worried about our defense going forward. IMO we will have to start outscoring teams instead of eeking out 14-10 or 10-7 games against middlin teams. Let me also say you are 100 percent correct about this being a direct result of the end of the season. There were times when I could have sworn I was watching 2013 all over again.

 

[TLB]

8-10 wins is mediocrity, IMO

We should have 10 wins every single season. Period.

I don't really see how anyone could disagree with what Law has to say here. 8 or 9 wins is no great feat . ....The truth is good coaches/recruiters turn programs around sooner than later. Meyer, SOS, Saban, all had their teams competing for titles within 2 or 3 years. In fact Saban and Meyer have done it twice. Harbaugh has Michigan back to Top 10 status after 1 year. Hell even Jimbo had the Noles winning 10 plus games, winning conference titles, and in general has had them in the top 10 every year since his second

Crap happens all the time. Great coaches overcome these issues. They just do.

Such is life. Muschamp had 4-8 with a ton of injuries. Great coaches OVERCOME your pre-ordained excuses. I;m so sick of these garbage excuses every year. Win or get gone

Just a bit of a reality check here. Yes, great coaches can overcome some issues, they scheme around their team's shortcomings and find ways to exploit their strengths. But some of you seem to ignore the reality that some things can't be overcome. Mac's first year he's dealing with a RSFreshman QB that proved to be a bonehead and a backup that shouldn't even be on the depth chart. There is a limit to what a GREAT coach can overcome. And year two isn't magical, despite what you have seen by some of these GREAT coaches.

8-10 wins appears to be the mid-acceptance range, let's call it 10 for argument's sake of that range. Is that in a season that includes the SECCG? I know we'd all want to be there every year, and we would obviously include a bowl game, but do we take the SECCG as a given part of the schedule? Again, for the sake of argument, I'll include it, so on average a season these days has 14 chance to win (12 regular season, SECCG, Bowl Game). Getting 10/14 is only a 71% winning percentage, I think we'd all agree that's not impressive.


Bear Bryant (NCAA career 75% winning percentage)
UK - avg 64% in first 3 yrs
ATM - avg 57% in first 3 yrs
ALA - avg 63% in first 3 yrs <<NC yr 4>>

SOS (NCAA 72%)
Duke 59% first 3 yrs
FLA 78% first 3 yrs <<NC yr 7>>
USCe 57% first 3 yrs <<< 64% overall

Meyer (NCAA 85%)
BG - 74% (only 2 seasons)
UT - 92% (2 seasons)
FLA 79% first 3 yrs (81% overall) <<NC in yr 2>>
tOSU 93% firs 3 yrs (93% overall)

Saban (NCAA 76%)
Toledo 82% (one year)
MSU 53% first 3 yrs (58% over 5 yrs)
LSU 68% first 3 yrs (75% over 5 yrs) <<NC yr 4>>
ALA 80% first 3 yrs (85% over 9 yrs) <<NC yr 3>>

Dumbo (NCAA 83%)
FSU 75% first 3 yrs (83% over 6 yrs) <<NC yr 4>>

Harbaugh (NCAA 61%)
STAN 46% over first 3 yrs (57% over 4 yrs)
MICH 77% in first year

EDIT TO ADD MAC FOR COMPARISON
MAC (NCAA 61%)
CSU 58% over 3 yr
FLA 71% in first yr


My point is even the GREAT coaches (except Meyer and Dumbo) seem to struggle the first 3 yrs. The great Satan struggled at MSU before refining 'the process' for LSU and ALA, and even LSU was only barely above 'acceptable'. Bryant never did that well when taking over a program, and SOS got it right just the once with FLA.

Competing for NC's early? Other than Meyer doing it with Zook's players, the other GREAT coaches needed 3-4 yrs. Conference titles? Yes, nearly all have a conference title within the first 2-3 yrs at their final program....Mac got his in his first year.

You can argue all you want about different conference strengths, different eras, different talent on rosters....I'll just point back to your own words about GREAT coaches overcome. "But we are FLORIDA!!!??!?" Great coaches overcome. Then I'll point back to the numbers that don't lie - it takes time. As such, Mac has this year and next to establish success, IMO.

 

[alcoholica]

Crap happens all the time. Great coaches overcome these issues. They just do. I just feel like our fanbase is way too attached to excuse syndrome. It's been going on for far too long. Mac will succeed or he won't. Grier isn't going to make or break him. That's just stupid.

I agree to an extent. Mac inherited poor depth and we all thought it would take him 3-5 yrs to correct. Now his 1st yr success is going to cost him his job? I think he'll have a good second year, but he is still rebuilding the roster. Our Oline will be better, but it will be young and inexperienced. There are excuses and facts. The fact is that we overachieved big time last year. The Grier debacle is not an excuse, it's a window into how fragile the team was. Poor recruiting is not an excuse. It's a fact. Muschamp didn't meet needs and Mac's staff **** the bed (to an extent). Not excuses, just facts. If we only win 7 games next year it may not be a terrible thing. It will depend on how we lose and why we lose. Losses like Michigan are unacceptable. Personally, I think we are 1st or 2nd in the East.

 

[Concrete Helmet]

FLA 78% first 3 yrs

FLA 79% first 3 yrs (81% overall)

LSU 68% first 3 yrs (75% over 5 yrs)
ALA 80% first 3 yrs (85% over 9 yrs)

FSU 75% first 3 yrs (83% over 6 yrs)

MICH 77% in first year

What do you notice about the items I selected from your list?
That's right, they're all football powerhouses that have the reputation and resources to win big in 2 or 3 years max. If you notice UF is also on that list.....

 

[TLB]

What do you notice about the items I selected from your list?
That's right, they're all football powerhouses that have the reputation and resources to win big in 2 or 3 years max. If you notice UF is also on that list.....

Agreed, we ought to be in that class of program. I don't feel we are, coming out of the WM era, but that's my opinion. The right coach ought to be able to leverage the resources for a quick return. Some feel yr 1 or 2 is the time limit for such a return. I disagree. That's the point I was making - regardless of program or coach, even the best need up to 3 yrs depending on the condition of the program when they came in. I'm not sure my numbers say that directly....I just like to hear myself talk.

 

[TLB]

For further comparison (or because I like to hear myself talk), focusing on the FLA powerhouse....

SOS 78% first 3 yrs, 81% over 11 yrs
Zook 62% over 3 yrs
Meyer 79% in 3 yrs, 81% over 6 yrs
WM 54% in 3 yrs, 52% over 4 yrs
MAC 71% in first year

 

[Alagator]

For further comparison (or because I like to hear myself talk), focusing on the FLA powerhouse....

SOS 78% first 3 yrs, 81% over 11 yrs
Zook 62% over 3 yrs
Meyer 79% in 3 yrs, 81% over 6 yrs
WM 54% in 3 yrs, 52% over 4 yrs
MAC 71% in first year

Well so far, Mac is in good company... + 70%...

Not bad coming out of the WM era. Not sure any other UF coach has inherited such a cluster fk. I mean has any other coach EVER had to complete his first Spring Practice with 6 healthy scholarship OL? Has any other had to start the season with really only one option at QB and then complete the second half of the season with a QB roster so bad that he had to leave the new starter in there, even though he could only muster two offensive touchdowns the three games ?

I get we are all apprehensive because of the way we finished the season. I for one, am sure hoping that a true Coach Mac led team more closely resembles what we saw in the first half of the season and the unraveling we witnessed was a direct result of our personnel limitations.

Only time will tell.

 

[GMDGator]

So has Grier surfaced anywhere yet?

 

[lagator]

Well so far, Mac is in good company... + 70%...

Not bad coming out of the WM era. Not sure any other UF coach has inherited such a cluster fk. I mean has any other coach EVER had to complete his first Spring Practice with 6 healthy scholarship OL? Has any other had to start the season with really only one option at QB and then complete the second half of the season with a QB roster so bad that he had to leave the new starter in there, even though he could only muster two offensive touchdowns the three games ?

I get we are all apprehensive because of the way we finished the season. I for one, am sure hoping that a true Coach Mac led team more closely resembles what we saw in the first half of the season and the unraveling we witnessed was a direct result of our personnel limitations.

Only time will tell.

We gave up 41 points, 34 unanswered last time we saw Mac's team. How was that personnel limitations? Looked more like a team quitting on their coach to me. I'm more interested in how we finish next year rather than how we start.

 

[TheDouglas78]

Who's saying Hall of Fame? For anyone to argue that Applewood or Del Rio has shown as much as a guy who stood in the line of fire and dropped dimes in REAL SEC games is borderline blind homerism. As far as Grier having a better line, I would dispute that our pass protection was better at the end of the year than the beginning. It was the run blocking that got worse....I guess it wasn't the Oompa Loompa's fault he couldn't see wide open receivers though.

Yes Grier really blew up that Kentucky, Missouri, and for 3 quarters against Tennesse. He played well against SEC defenses for 5 quarters of SEC play. But again he was a Great SEC quarterback.. how about you take your own advice and reward his film. One of those quarters Tennesse handed us a game, similar to how they did for Harris in 2014. The pass blocking looked better because Harris didn't need to be rushed because he is a dwarf. But Grier is a great SEC qb because he was better than Harris. Harris was great because he was better than Driskel. Sounds like a BS argument. Grier might have been great, but all he showed in 6 games and 5 starters was that he was better than Harris in year one of a new offense against a weak schedule. Harris looked pretty good against LSU until defenses adjusted to him after Georgia.

 

[Concrete Helmet]

Yes Grier really blew up that Kentucky, Missouri, and for 3 quarters against Tennesse. He played well against SEC defenses for 5 quarters of SEC play. But again he was a Great SEC quarterback.. how about you take your own advice and reward his film. One of those quarters Tennesse handed us a game, similar to how they did for Harris in 2014. The pass blocking looked better because Harris didn't need to be rushed because he is a dwarf. But Grier is a great SEC qb because he was better than Harris. Harris was great because he was better than Driskel. Sounds like a BS argument. Grier might have been great, but all he showed in 6 games and 5 starters was that he was better than Harris in year one of a new offense against a weak schedule. Harris looked pretty good against LSU until defenses adjusted to him after Georgia.

OK, well I sure hope Johnny Appleseed or The Wonderer is as good as Grier then....

 

[Swamp Donkey]

We gave up 41 points, 34 unanswered last time we saw Mac's team. How was that personnel limitations? Looked more like a team quitting on their coach to me. I'm more interested in how we finish next year rather than how we start.

This concerns me a good deal.

I've never seen a team that quit on a coach ever unquit.

 

[Swamp Donkey]

Just a bit of a reality check here.

Nobody loves losing and losers like TLB.

 

[Swamp Donkey]

EVER had to complete his first Spring Practice with 6 healthy scholarship OL?...

My concern isn't really how the season went. We had 7-5 talent and overachieved drastically. We hid the putrid OL for as long as we could. Having a coked out QB and kicker didn't help.

The problem is recruiting. The record of the team in two years will reflect that recruiting. Last year it wasn't his fault. Chimp and crew just stopped recruiting and decided to screw us (and his buddy Fooley). They did so. I've never even seen a group of coaches just stop recruiting and coaching before. Fooley should have stopped paying them but he has no testicles.

You expect the first year recruiting to be poor, and that accounts for the ever so common third year slump. No we have a poor second year class and gaping holes still at LB, DT, and OL which will account for a fourth year slump also.

It's going to be a while. I'm not sure Mac and Fooley make it to year five and it will take at least six years unless something very drastic happens (like an influx of excellent assistant coaches to recruit a small but stellar class this year capable of being instant contributors).

 

[LagoonGator68]

This concerns me a good deal.

I've never seen a team that quit on a coach ever unquit.

The ole hee haw schtick is wearing thin with big sky boy.

 

[alcoholica]

My concern isn't really how the season went. We had 7-5 talent and overachieved drastically. We hid the putrid OL for as long as we could. Having a coked out QB and kicker didn't help.

The problem is recruiting. The record of the team in two years will reflect that recruiting. Last year it wasn't his fault. Chimp and crew just stopped recruiting and decided to screw us (and his buddy Fooley). They did so. I've never even seen a group of coaches just stop recruiting and coaching before. Fooley should have stopped paying them but he has no testicles.

You expect the first year recruiting to be poor, and that accounts for the ever so common third year slump. No we have a poor second year class and gaping holes still at LB, DT, and OL which will account for a fourth year slump also.

It's going to be a while. I'm not sure Mac and Fooley make it to year five and it will take at least six years unless something very drastic happens (like an influx of excellent assistant coaches to recruit a small but stellar class this year capable of being instant contributors).

We'll need to push a lot of kids out just to have a class of 20. Sousa, Treon are two candidates, but I'm sure we can push some others out.

 

[CGgater]

We gave up 41 points, 34 unanswered last time we saw Mac's team. How was that personnel limitations? Looked more like a team quitting on their PATHETIC OFFENSE to me. I'm more interested in how we finish next year rather than how we start.

FIFY.

Is it me or did all the Chicken Littles get together for a crack & LSD party?


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